HelpMeFind Roses, Clematis and Peonies
Roses, Clematis and Peonies
and everything gardening related.
DescriptionPhotosLineageAwardsReferencesMember RatingsMember CommentsMember JournalsCuttingsGardensBuy From 
'Belle de Londres ®' rose Reviews & Comments
Discussion id : 96-734
most recent 11 JAN HIDE POSTS
 
Initial post 9 JAN by happymaryellen
How interesting to read the varieties of thoughts on this rose. I planted one and have another one coming to plant, the voice of Northern California here!! Will report back how they fare! I will have them in full sun, so based on what I read, should be white flowers and hopefully no mildew....but gotta say, I get ocean breezes that carry fungus, so we shall see!! Always fun to try!
REPLY
Reply #1 of 12 posted 10 JAN by Jay-Jay
Why do You expect white flowers on Your Compassion?
REPLY
Reply #2 of 12 posted 10 JAN by happymaryellen
Because somebody replied earlier that there Bush got a lot of sun, and it bleached The petals and I planted mine in the location it will get sun all day long
REPLY
Reply #3 of 12 posted 10 JAN by Jay-Jay
You might ask member "Organic Roses Honeybee Garden" to post some pictures of those bleached out Compassion flowers. Only she didn't visit HMF for over one year.
However the photo's she did post of Compassion on HMF were of vibrant colored flowers.
REPLY
Reply #4 of 12 posted 10 JAN by happymaryellen
Hope abounds!!
REPLY
Reply #5 of 12 posted 10 JAN by Jay-Jay
Not only the thoughts vary... the fragrance varies during seasons and even during the day.
From just (almost synthetic) apple-flavor to more subtler and mixed wonderful perfumes of old rose, citrus, cedar bitter almond. It doesn't have a long vase-life.
REPLY
Reply #6 of 12 posted 10 JAN by happymaryellen
I have noticed as a newcomer to roses, and I only have about 35 roses right now, fragrance does seem to be something that varies throughout the day throughout the season etc. That's good to know that this one is a variable thank you for letting me know. It's also good to know that it doesn't have an extended vase shelflife. I actually planned at this one to be more of a climber on a short fence that I have At this stage I'm planting some roses for just being in the garden, many of my David Austin's and bushes, including the compassion . I've also planted some hybrids for presentation At roseshows. This is my second winter of conscientious rose gardening. Sure is fun!
REPLY
Reply #7 of 12 posted 10 JAN by Jay-Jay
... on a short fence... when trained between a horizontal and 45 degree angle, it makes lots of very strong, long and robust upright laterals, is my experience.
It performs better, when it is allowed to climb higher.
REPLY
Reply #8 of 12 posted 10 JAN by happymaryellen
Define "higher"? Thus fence is about three feet...most of the roses i have been graining to go horizontal...not good?
REPLY
Reply #9 of 12 posted 10 JAN by Jay-Jay
3m up and maybe higher, see f.i. http://www.helpmefind.com/rose/l.php?l=21.60470.
My fence is at Compassion 1.60m and it wants to go way higher.
Low horizontal canes tend to die.
REPLY
Reply #10 of 12 posted 10 JAN by happymaryellen
Nice shot!
REPLY
Reply #11 of 12 posted 11 JAN by Jay-Jay
It was not my shot, nor my fence. The photo (of someone else) displayed/showed well, what I meant about height.
REPLY
Reply #12 of 12 posted 11 JAN by happymaryellen
Oh, I see!!
REPLY
Discussion id : 72-315
most recent 16 MAY 15 SHOW ALL
 
Initial post 11 JUN 13 by selectroses
I find it interesting to read how this rose is reported healthy in some climates. In the Vancouver BC Canada area its highly prone to black spot and mildew, and will defoliate by early summer in most years. I don't think I have ever seen a healthy plant of this in my area and we stopped selling it at our nursery years ago. I love its fragrance but can't think of a rose more prone to all diseases. I do enjoy reading this site though and comparing notes on which roses are healthy in certain climates!
REPLY
Reply #1 of 17 posted 11 JUN 13 by Jay-Jay
Never seen mildew on this rose and in my garden no significant Blackspot.
However... in the Rosarium of Winschoten there was a very old and healthy plant (see my photo's of it on HMF summer 2009 clean leaves and in octobre some BS), that suddenly got prone to Blackspot in fall and complete(new and old canes) died next year and the winter after this happened it completely gave up.
It was pruneshoveled and a new/other climber was planted.
REPLY
Reply #2 of 17 posted 11 JUN 13 by selectroses
Wow I have never seen a compassion not covered in mildew! When we used to sell it we tried spraying every 7days and still could not keep it clean, but again different roses for different climates. Mildew is very extreme in my climate, and black spot affects many roses. The famous Eden climber is another one that can't really be grown here due to disease, yet I see it thriving in parts of Euroope. I guess that's why so many different types of roses are out there. Keeps us breeders busy too haha.
REPLY
Reply #4 of 17 posted 11 JUN 13 by Rupert, Kim L.
Compassion was quite healthy in my climate, but we're significantly hotter and more arid than where you live, Brad. It's been very interesting in the past year or so, learning how they have isolated fifteen races of black spot world wide, with five here in the US. I don't know how many races you have in Canada. That, alone, explains why a rose completely spotless in one place is horrible in another. It's also extremely interesting how water can affect the plant's immune system.

Nature uses water, and the lack of it, to signal some species roses it's time to drop their foliage in preparation for winter extremes. R. Arkansana rusts badly in late fall where it is indigenous. I've grown only one hybrid Arkansana here which wasn't extremely afflicted with rust. I had to give my Arkansana away because if it missed watering it, the whole plant, including new foliage, broke out in heavy rust. Watering it as if I was trying to drown it cleared up the rust on all the new growth and kept it clean until water ran short again. I finally shovel pruned Heritage because it always had rust, black spot and mildew on the whole plant. The combination of climate, soil type and micro climate required I water the plant heavily, daily or it would not remain healthy. I don't/can't/won't spray here for a variety of reasons. A rose which can't live healthily with my water and conditions doesn't belong here. It has been very interesting experimenting with water levels and schedules and seeing how it affects the basic health of rose varieties. Of course it greatly affects growth and flowering, but it can make, or break, many with their basic disease resistance. Something I guess we should realize intuitively, but stressing with too little water can literally force an otherwise healthy rose to develop heavy fungal issues.
REPLY
Reply #5 of 17 posted 11 JUN 13 by selectroses
Hi Kim,
Climate sure does play a major role. Your area is far better for average rose health than our rainy damp climate. I'm always amazed at the health reports on roses on this site. Many that I see listed as clean are defolaited here by mid June. Julia Child for instance does well yet in some gardens I have seen it 50% defoliated already this year, same for Livin Easy. We get lots of downy and powdery mildew. My seedlings are usually 80% severly affected with mildew before first flowering so anything we to test out has incredible resistance under high pressures. It will often rain here for days and nights on end which makes some roses just sulk. I see great reports on the white Pope JP 2 rose, but it can't be grown here unless you spray ( most sprays are banned and people won't spray). That is one reason why rose sales in my region are at an all time low. The Kordes line of roses is by far the best for my area but some of the Easy Elegance type are good. Most of the typical HT roses are defoliated here in a few months. We have rain from October to June, often for 15 or more days a month, then its dry July to Sept. Nights are oh 50-60 in summer, days 70-75? 85 is hot, 90 is smoking hot for us but only a few days a summer are those temps! The rest of the year is cold and wet! Welcome to Vancouver hahaha. Winters here are not as cold as other parts of Canada, but we do have -10c or even -15c in some years.
REPLY
Reply #6 of 17 posted 11 JUN 13 by Rupert, Kim L.
Absolutely, climate determines almost everything! This is a savannah climate. Our "average annual rainfall" is just under 15", though in 2011 we received about a third of that average and in 2012, very slightly more, about 7". "Winters" have been extremely mild in comparison to everywhere else, even the average here. We had two whole "frosts" where temps dipped to 32F and bounced right back up. The average lows weren't much less than 40F. We had heat spells in the 80s over "winter". This year has bounced all over from gray, foggy, damp in the 60s and 70s to very windy, arid and HOT, spiking into the low triple digits. Chilly, damp nights with arid, windy, hot and brilliant days, but at least it cools off at night! Humidity can range from nearly 90% over night to single digit in the afternoon. The "rainy season" is traditionally November through April, though we received a very late rain this year. Fire season has traditionally been from July through October, but it's rapidly become nearly year round. Things are definitely changing and not always for the better. Extremes are becoming more extreme and more the 'norm'.
REPLY
Reply #7 of 17 posted 11 JUN 13 by Jay-Jay
Mildew is an issue in my garden, because of the big oaks surrounding it: they get mildew like mad.
even the grass sometimes moulds with it.
At first my Compassion (ex Bierkreek) stood next to Warm Wishes; the latter got badly affected by downy mildew, but no sign of it on Compassion.
The leaves start shiny red-purple-brownish and get dark green and leathery when mature.
The place where it stands gets a lot of shade and a few hours of direct sunlight.
No optimal conditions.
It only froze back completely to the ground in the winter of 2011/2012.
But that was a very cold (bare frosts + a lot of sunshine) and late winter after a warm end of the year till january 25.
I didn't know You were Brad and that You breed roses too. You will select Your own roses for health, I presume?
If I remember it well, You were at the "Rozenfestival" of De Bierkreek last year.
REPLY
Reply #8 of 17 posted 11 JUN 13 by selectroses
Hi there! I sure was at the rose fest and will go there next year again. I'm glad that Compassion is healthy for you but it still shocks me as it isn't healthy here. It's it amazing how a rose can do in other climates. We test fully no spray on our roses in very challenged conditions then send the best ones to other growers like our friends in The Netherlands. They will have some of my roses to offer next year but they first have to test which roses do well there. I need a healthy pink climber to sell to our customers so I do wish Compassion would grow better here, but it's the worst of the worst hahaha. Now if it grows that well for you I can see why it's so popular in many parts of the world. It keeps rose breeders busy trying to test roses for each climate. How does the Harkness rose Fellowship/ LIving Easy grow in your climate?
Cheers
Brad
REPLY
Reply #9 of 17 posted 11 JUN 13 by Jay-Jay
I wouldn't call Compassion a pink rose... sometimes it is pinkish, but mixed with other colours like off-white, orange, buff and yellow. depending on the weather and maybe again climate. In fall it gets more pinkish, sometimes even with some green.
Most of the time it is a variable colour leaning towards orange.

Would You consider Kim's Annie Laurie McDowell as a pink(-mauve) climber?
This year even my Mme Alfred Carrière was Pinkish and that's a strong, resilient and healthy climber.(in my opinion and experience) The Rosarium of Winschoten is not very far from the sea and over there it performs good in a berceau mostly covered with ramblers.

You asked: "How does the Harkness rose Fellowship/ Living Easy grow in your climate?"
I had it in my garden, but it didn't thrive, grew backwards and died last winter.
it wasn't living easy at all.
Regards, J.J.
REPLY
Reply #3 of 17 posted 11 JUN 13 by selectroses
Wow I have never seen a compassion not covered in mildew! When we used to sell it we tried spraying every 7days and still could not keep it clean, but again different roses for different climates. Mildew is very extreme in my climate, and black spot affects many roses. The famous Eden climber is another one that can't really be grown here due to disease, yet I see it thriving in parts of Euroope. I guess that's why so many different types of roses are out there. Keeps us breeders busy too haha.
REPLY
Reply #10 of 17 posted 24 JUN 13 by Simon Voorwinde
Brad, it seems your climate and mine (Tasmania, Australia) are very similar; short growing season, cold winters, lots of rain, with a short but sometimes very hot, summer. We get struck by downy mildew badly each spring and powdery mildew in the Autumn when the days are warm and the nights cold. Black spot rules during the spring and summer and, like you have found, the newer Kordes releases are by far the best on offer to the point that I am almost ignoring releases from others. They just never live up to the hype ('Wildcat' won the most disease resistant rose in trial a few years back at the Australian Trial grounds and I've barely seen a leaf on it here). Many of the Kordes roses can be traced back to wichurana ( via 'The Fairy' and 'Immensee' + some others), and I think this has a lot to do with why they do so well here. Kim reports that a lot of wichurana hybrids get crown gall for him but I have never even seen crown gall here in Australia, though I'm lead to believe it is here. 'Pierre de Ronsard' (Eden Climber) is a strong and healthy rose here for the most part but does get black spot and rust and seems to have only a small window of spotlessness. It doesn't seem to affect the growth or flowering but when some roses are putting on a decent autumn show, PDR is languishing in black spottiness as it gears down early for winter. If you get a chance, try and get hold of 'Summer Memories' which is also one of the newer Kordes releases. It produces pollen and forms OP hips though I have not tried to germinate any of these yet. I suspect the germination rate won't be high and that it is probably triploid as Kordes seem almost to select for triploidy on purpose. It is rather spectacular here. 'Manita' is a good strong super healthy pink climber, also by Kordes, that your customers might like if you are looking for such a rose. It also forms many hips and the seeds germinate easily producing strong climbing seedlings. The flower form is not very appealing to me but I'm sure matched to the right parent this could be overcome. If you are looking to breed such a rose have a look at 'Pink Emely'. This little rose is quite amazing here. Right now, almost a month into winter, we are freezing solid almost every clear still night and PE is covered in leaves and flowers still. It is not overly vigorous but very, very healthy. It has accepted pollen from a range of roses this season for me and I am particularly looking forward to seeing what 'Pink Emely' x 'Cornelia' can turn up.

I don't believe there is any such thing as a rose that is healthy everywhere. In many ways I don't think it's something breeder's should be worried about as I like the idea of producing locally successful roses.
REPLY
Reply #11 of 17 posted 15 MAY 15 by celeryrose
I have never seen any mildew ever on mine. My garden is in Richmond, BC just west of your nursery. My plant does get some blackspot but nothing to worry about. I bought in 1985, a multiflora graft from Pickering Nurseries. It has since been moved twice but has been in the same spot since 1992. It is squeezed between a eastern cedar and a holly bush and receives very little care, yet comes back every year with a steady supply of blossoms mostly in clusters with a few singles. It also has no problems producing basal breaks despite its age for a grafted rose. The leaves are thick and substantial.even when they have black spot and it never becomes defoliated because of it. You have never seen a plant without mildew, yet I have never seen mine with it. While I certainly have problem plants, Compassion is not one of them. I think this is consistent with it being a British bred cultivar. I wonder why your experience is so different from mine?
REPLY
Reply #12 of 17 posted 15 MAY 15 by Robert Neil Rippetoe
"I wonder why your experience is so different from mine?"

It's because your climate isn't conducive to Powdery Mildew infection.

It mildewed badly here in CA's low desert as well. We never see Blackspot
REPLY
Reply #13 of 17 posted 15 MAY 15 by celeryrose
Hi there, thanks for the reply. I was meaning specifically that the Select Rose Nursery is less than 43 kilometers drive from me. I'm a little farther north and a little closer to the water, however I.m guessing that the conditions would not be that different. Sorry for the confusion. Mildew is a problem here Especially in early spring and late summer. I am in a rain forest after all, I just don't see it on Compassion..
REPLY
Reply #14 of 17 posted 15 MAY 15 by Robert Neil Rippetoe
"I just don't see it on Compassion.."


In that case you are lucky..
REPLY
Reply #15 of 17 posted 15 MAY 15 by Jay-Jay
If so... Than me too Robert!
REPLY
Reply #16 of 17 posted 15 MAY 15 by Robert Neil Rippetoe
I never see Blackspot. I'm lucky too. ;-)
REPLY
Reply #17 of 17 posted 16 MAY 15 by celeryrose
I see blackspot, but I still feel lucky. If I had put any effort into spraying it, of course I would be disappointed. But, it doesn't mildew and keeps growing. Because of where it is, it doesn't get any fertilizer or watering either. Now that I think of it, I'm not nice to it at all! I originally planted it as free standing bush, but it has since decided to take over the holly tree next to it. They are both about 15 feet tall. Behind you can see one of the two cedar trees that border it. After this current flush I will probably cut it (and the holly) down by about three feet, and it will probably respond by growing right back up to where it is now. In the photo I uploaded two days ago you can see the holly tree behind the flowers as well. That picture was taken at eye level. Luckily, it breaks at the bottom so I get to see flowers from below eye level too. It is very much like my other free standing rose, New Dawn, in that it absolutely does not need nor gets any coddling. Picture taken May 16th, 2015
REPLY
Discussion id : 74-329
most recent 30 SEP 13 HIDE POSTS
 
Initial post 30 SEP 13 by Renato Emma
Syn.'Belle de Londres'
Famosissima rosa rampicante Floribunda/Grandiflora, a portamento vigoroso, ricurvo e ben ramificato. Fogliame folto, lucido, verde scuro. Fiori grandi, singoli o in mazzi, rosa salmone, fragranza intensa di Rosa Tea, con accenni di miele. Resistente a freddo e malattie. Rifiorente. H.4,5mt L.2,5mt. Premiata con RHS/RNRS Award of Garden Merit
(ROSACEAE) (Jack Harkness, Robert Harckness & Co.Ltd, UK, 1972)
REPLY
Discussion id : 27-448
most recent 2 OCT 11 SHOW ALL
 
Initial post 17 JUN 08 by jdsong
Does this rose flower most of the summer? Does it fade quickly?
REPLY
Reply #1 of 2 posted 21 JUN 08 by Cass
Compassion does repeat well. It is a subtle color, and in the hottest summer months, it does fade. A little mid-day filtered shade helps a lot. I have one facing north on a wire fence that provides just enough filtering to greatly diminish fading. A second plant in dawn to dusk sun does fade in late June and July.
REPLY
Reply #2 of 2 posted 2 OCT 11 by Organic Roses-Honeybee Garden
I love how BS resistant and vigorous and great bloom producer this rose is and its perfume is so wonderful....But the nightmare with Compassion is that the sun (from June until the end of September) completely washes out my Compassion to white! It's in partial sun too! During the afternoons, the large shadow of the house is supposed to keep it shielded, but to no avail....Just the morning sun is enough to "dump bleach" on its blooms during Midwest blazing summers...In fall Compassion regains back some of the peaches, but this does not occur as rapidly as it should....
REPLY
© 2017 HelpMeFind.com