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'George Elger' rose Reviews & Comments
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Initial post
20 OCT 20 by
bibi
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The George Elger sold in Europe seems to be Perle d'or. I have bought two plants, one in Germany and one in France and I don't manage to make a difference with Perle d'or. They are not yellow like on your photos.
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Yes, the first three photos on the George Elger file, taken in Europe, look like Perle d'Or.
Our George Elger - of which there are only a few plants left - is yellow, but not "coppery yellow" as in the early references. .
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#2 of 5 posted
20 OCT 20 by
 jedmar
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This is the L'Hay photo of 'Georges Elger' which they have
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It would be interesting to know whether the Georges Elger at L'Hay is thornless. The Australian one seems to be, and there's been a suggestion that the foundling "Schmidt's Smooth Yellow" in the US may be the same rose. Both have a red tinge on the buds, which might fit in with the coppery-yellow description. No mention of absence of prickles in the references for George Elger.
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#3 of 5 posted
20 OCT 20 by
bibi
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Who still have or sell the yellow George Elger ?
Apparently by reading l'Hay les roses website they don't have Georges Elger in culture anymore.
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#5 of 5 posted
21 OCT 20 by
jedmar
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Yes, it seems two plants were planted in 2000 and removed end of 2006. Indicates it was also an incorrect rose.
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Margaret, I wish to thank you immensely for adding some more pictures to 'George Elger' on here. And someone please thank Ozoldroser as well. Jeri Jennings recently posted some pics of her "Schmidt's Smooth Yellow" on the Antique Roses Forum on Houzz (formerly GardenWeb), and it engendered a rehash of my thought that that rose is actually 'George Elger'. Jacqueline Schmidt -- the discoverer of the found-rose -- agreed that photos of 'George Elger' are identical to her "Schmidt's Smooth Yellow." I understand that one of Malcolm Manners' students has included a genetic comparison between "Schmidt's Smooth Yellow" and 'Sunshine', purported to be a seedling of 'George Elger'. Whenever those results become published, we'll have more evidence.
The discussions below:
www.houzz.com/discussions/5841095/schmidt-s-smooth-yellow#n=17
www.houzz.com/discussions/5406060/schmidt-s-smooth-yellow#n=28
:-)
~Christopher
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As an aside but adding to the possible attribution, I've noted that Turbat was also responsible for other introductions that led to smooth offspring, such as 'Étoile Luisante', and it's offspring, 'Renae'.
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You're welcome. I have given my cutting-grown plants away to nurseries and a major repository, but it's time I kept one for myself. Such a joy to have a poly that doesn't bite.
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"Such a joy to have a poly that doesn't bite"
OR ANY rose that doesn't bite!
Over the years I have been eaten alive.
Just so folks know. It's EASY to breed smooth roses. I've bred many.
There's no need at all for roses to bite the hand that feeds them.
If gardener sought them out we would have no more vicious roses to contend with. =)
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I tried to breed smooth groundcovers. i selected all the seedlings which were smooth in their first year. The second year, they changed...
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You need to choose your genetics more wisely. YES, smooth groundcovers are a great goal to keep in mind. Honestly, I have never tried to breed one but it wouldn't be specially difficult.
Roses as groundcovers seem not to be too popular here in general. Of course that could be because the prickles are so problematic??
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#6 of 8 posted
25 DEC 19 by
Plazbo
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The multiflora rootstock Thomas For Roses used is entirely thornless (including the spikes commonly under leaflets). Granted it appears to be once blooming and possibly not the best base to create a ground cover from but may have some use in being a stepping stone, particularly given how many ground covers are diploid/triploid.
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Actually some of us are way past this now. The work has already been done on both a tetra and diploid level.
The problem is most companies are not willing to market the products because they just don't see the need for it.
Smoothness will only come along for the ride assuming all other commercial requirements are met.
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Several problems - nasty to weed among prickles, and you have to because "groundcover" roses generally aren't dense enough to suppress weeds: and they're a long way down to deadhead, unless you follow advice I was given and use a golfclub.
See separate posting re Thomas for Roses.
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The Rose in India p. 289 (1972)
Benjamin Peary Pal
GEORGE ELGER (Turbat, 1912); also known as YELLOW BABY RAMBLER
Clear yellow but with a coppery shading. Dwarf-growing. One of the few yellow Polyanthas.
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Both have the square-topped buds, and fade to cream. Can't help much, because as far as I can see they're not grown on the same continent.
The plant at Renmark came from Trewallyn Nursery, but it isn't on their current list.
Correction: George Elger is listed for a garden in Texas.
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#2 of 8 posted
4 OCT 17 by
AquaEyes
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Well, one thing to ask -- does your GE have prickles? The foundling in the US is so-named because it lacks prickles.
There is another possible way to confirm if SSY = GE, and that would be to do a DNA test of SSY as a possible mother of 'Sunshine', whose seed-parent was listed as being GE.
:-)
~Christopher
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I'll check next time I'm in Renmark, which probably won't be till late November. And take cuttings.
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I've been given cuttings 20-25cm long. There are tiny hooks on the petioles, but no obvious prickles further down. Of course I can't comment yet on older wood.
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#5 of 8 posted
27 FEB 18 by
AquaEyes
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Somehow, my original comment starting this thread disappeared. For anyone else reading it now, I wrote about whether or not 'George Elger' might be the correct identity for the found rose "Schmidt's Smooth Yellow", which has also been likened to 'Eugenie Lamesch'.
:-)
~Christopher
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It hasn't disappeared, Christopher. It is still sitting on the Comments for "Schmidt's Smooth Yellow".
We have Noted that "Schmidt's Smooth Yellow" is
Possibly 'Eugenie Lamesch' 1899
Possibly 'George Elger' 1912
Possibly the same as "Belmont Yellow" but research is on-going
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I had a quick look at old wood on the Renmark plant recently, but the photo failed. No obvious prickles.
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#8 of 8 posted
28 FEB 18 by
AquaEyes
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Yes, but I posted both there and here, and Margaret Furness responded to it here. That response is now the first post in this discussion, rather than my original here. I just wanted to clarify in case anyone else reads this thread.
:-)
~Christopher
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Yes, I see what you mean Christopher. Something is a little odd - especially when your last comment in this thread is numbered 8 of 7.
....well, it was, a second ago before my reply, which is numbered 9 of 8. (I was never very good with sums.)
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