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'KORlawe' rose Reviews & Comments
Discussion id : 107-064
most recent 20 DEC HIDE POSTS
 
Initial post 20 DEC by mamabotanica
Saw a description of Westerland on the regan nursery site that mentioned it's prolific blooms from even the first year. I have mine in a spot in an east facing corner of the garden and wonder if it's not getting enough sun as mine has only made a small show of a couple flowers. It's still in it's first year so maybe I'm being impatient? I figure I'll give any roses 3 years but I had high hopes for the fragrant blooms on this one and so far it's just growing super long tall canes.
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Reply #1 of 1 posted 20 DEC by jedmar
It is actually very prolific - I would give it a year or two. In our garden we have roses which exploded after 7 years!
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Discussion id : 88-701
most recent 14 OCT 15 HIDE POSTS
 
Initial post 14 OCT 15 by rosegeek
I live in zone 9, it gets hot in the summer where I live and I have it planted in partial shade. Westerland is very disease resistant and grows tall but the blooms leave a lot to be desired, infrequent blooms that scorch in the heat. The blooms are very fragrant though, they make a good cut flower. I regret buying it for my location, Westerland is better suited along the coast or mountains where the temps don't get above 85F(29C).
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Discussion id : 74-554
most recent 28 JUL 14 SHOW ALL
 
Initial post 14 OCT 13 by Organic Roses-Honeybee Garden
Hi, my good friend in Europe is breeding the shrub Westerland and this is how I noticed an accidental mislabeling of the Climbing Westerland. In the U.S. Westerland is a very! popular Climber and it does climb on trellises and archways. Had another friend who used to post photos of his on trellises on an American forum. The description label has to be switched over to "climber" for this specific area . It still reads as "shrub". And maybe comments need to be separated out so that shrub comments remain with the shrub version and the climber remains with the climber version! Or if Lyn can make final clarifications so that people don't mix the 2 together. As a web designer, I know this may be a bit of a bear (American slang for major headache) to correct, but hopefully someone on the administrative side can sort this out. Description still reads as shrub for HMF's "Climbing Westerland" so I think that's why we might have all the mixup? But then I'm not positive either. I'm just thinking that U.S. breeders specifically bred for the climbing version because it makes such a great climber here in our locale and our climate and / or sunlight conditions.
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Reply #1 of 19 posted 15 OCT 13 by Rupert, Kim L.
There is no confusion between the shrub and climbing form. Depending upon climate, many roses will either grow as shrubs, or explode into climbing growth depending upon the heat, light, length of season and other resources. Many English roses as well as Sally Holmes do exactly the same thing in longer season climates. Even though you will sometimes find nurseries and articles listing "Cl. Westerland", "Cl. Sally Holmes", they are the same, exact roses. They are simply being described by how they have performed for those describing them. Take a look at the David Austin Catalog. He will list the same rose as being able to be grown as a shrub as well as grown as a climber. But, they are still the same, exact roses.
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Reply #2 of 19 posted 15 OCT 13 by Organic Roses-Honeybee Garden
Oh, cool! Thanks for explaining, Kim!
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Reply #3 of 19 posted 15 OCT 13 by Rupert, Kim L.
You're welcome!
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Reply #4 of 19 posted 15 OCT 13 by Organic Roses-Honeybee Garden
haha, I also take things very literal! You should see my NYC Botanical Garden photo comment here, lol, lol! I got confused when someone had moved a label and I could not! for the life of me figure out what rose it was. (smack the forehead) I was doing a whooooa this name does not look like this rose and Palustris had to say break down for me in simpler terms for this simpleton on what had happened to this rose bwaha....

http://www.helpmefind.com/gardening/l.php?l=21.230078&tab=32

Still curious as to what this rose is. Color reminds me of my friend's seedling but petal shape is completely different.... hmmmmm
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Reply #5 of 19 posted 15 OCT 13 by Rupert, Kim L.
From the photo, it appears to be some sort of rambler. It could be visually misleading and actually be a smaller, dwarf plant. It's hard to tell from the image. If the garden has a list of the roses they grow, check their ramblers listed as growing there. I think you may find the identity there.
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Reply #6 of 19 posted 15 OCT 13 by Organic Roses-Honeybee Garden
Definitely camera angle distortion. Plant is under 4' like your 2nd guess (smaller dwarf) because the grey in the background is actually gravel. Plant is also in center aisle which makes things even more hard to guess, because climbers and ramblers are positioned against the outer walls. I tried looking under all the Kordes since it's one of the most popular breeds for NYCBG it seems. But as you can tell no luck with that. Nothing yet seems to match. The way it's clustered I would normally guess floribunda and flowers look too modern to be a hybrid musk and hybrid musks tend to be massive plants (instead of dwarf-y like this one). But then quite a few hybrid musks have very elliptical leaves and this rose has elliptical leaves. And the leaves seem very small and delicate. Leaves should give a good hint since it's atypical, but I'm somewhat of an idiot when it comes to breed knowledge, lol! So my guess is getting further and further "off" I'm sure! OK it's super late here so will have to sleep, haha! or else I will make lots of mistakes and make my clients mad :P Need to leave the detective work to you (the wise experts) haha!
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Reply #8 of 19 posted 15 OCT 13 by Rupert, Kim L.
Is it possible the rose is something of the polyantha class? Britiannia, for one, can resemble this type and coloring of flower depending upon conditions. You might look at single, reddish polys to find an identity.
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Reply #9 of 19 posted 15 OCT 13 by Organic Roses-Honeybee Garden
Whoo-hoo, on the Sherlock Holmes perfect mystery solution!!!! Thanks, Kim!! it is a polyantha for sure! Had to Google since I don't get to see these types of roses where I live! but photo after photo shows this exact same leaf shape and bloom clustering!!!! And there are several smaller height polyanthas shown via Google versus larger polyanthas. So excited - am narrowing down to a few magenta ones!!!
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Reply #7 of 19 posted 15 OCT 13 by Jay-Jay
Hi organic R&B garden.
I planted Westerland to be a climber, but it behaved at the same time like a free standing shrub too!
...So people got grabbed by the vicious hooked prickles, when they got out of their car on our driveway, so I removed it to another spot. See my pictures of the same rose. Before and after planting.
Over here, I would recommend it as a free standing shrub.
On the other hand, the Rosarium of Winschoten grows Lichtkönigin Lucia (shares ancestry with Westerland) as a shrub (see my photo's of that in 2009) ...But at our place it's a very satisfying good climber.(see my photo's too). It doesn't spread and arch that much from its base as the Westerland does.
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Reply #10 of 19 posted 15 OCT 13 by Organic Roses-Honeybee Garden
Hi, Jay-Jay! Ha ha on the thorny grab! Kim mentioned the situation that Westerland is the exact same breed of roses but perform differently depending on locale.And I know in Europe the sun rays are less direct compared to the blasting rays of U.S. MIdwest and the majority of California. But! In general Westerland in U.S. is a climber and does not have the same issue as my Climbing America which seems destined to remain a spreading "shrub" because it cannot handle high BS, my lazy *ss neglect, and! our pendulum swinging winters. A gardener warned me that my Climbing America will forever remain a pathetic shrub and will not perform well. But hard-headed me loved it so much that I have two, lol! Poor roses!!! But who knows, I believe sometimes certain climbers are turtles in starting out slow then gathering momentum. Compassion took 4 years before it started to begin its climber status.... Not every climber is an immediate monster like Viking Queen. But! that being said I also have Climbing Etoile de Hollande, which is listed as a regular shrub too. Haha, the annoying "pest" me (who happens to grow E de H) will be curious as to whether "shrub" Etoile de Hollande is indeed the "same" plant as the "climbing" Etoile de Hollande". If so, this will be another thing I am learning, lol! I used to always think that both shrub and climber were bred out to favor one characteristic (the climber gene) versus the original shrub gene. Also Jay-Jay, I looove your Westie! Hmmm, once it settles with the transplant, maybe??? it will eventually transform to its climber status. It certainly seems vigorous and happy enough to. I would love to see it in 3 additional years and compare....
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Reply #11 of 19 posted 15 OCT 13 by Jay-Jay
There is a distinct Étoile de Hollande AND a distinct sport of it: Étoile de Hollande Climbing!
I grow both and one is the climbing rose and one is the normal sized HT, that stays short.
So this is different from what Kim told You about roses acting both as a shrub and as a climber. Like some of the Austins do too. (when trained as a climber)
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Reply #12 of 19 posted 15 OCT 13 by Organic Roses-Honeybee Garden
Lol, another (smack on the forehead) I should have remembered to look at the BREEDER!!!! this is the definite indicator! AAAARGH haha! Reading the plant's original breeder is the clue.
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Reply #13 of 19 posted 15 OCT 13 by Jay-Jay
No a smack on the back of Your head ; )
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Reply #14 of 19 posted 15 OCT 13 by Organic Roses-Honeybee Garden
Lol, same thing (backwards and forwards) Jay-Jay! and BTW I need to stop writing on HMF during the day, eeeee! I forgot how addicting Rose talk is after being away for a year! May I blame my stupid "forehead" on not getting my real-life deadlines finished???? Must end thread before more stupidity revealed hahaha!
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Reply #15 of 19 posted 28 JUL 14 by Michael Garhart
If you want an explosive, easy climber, then try Sympathie or Salita. If you want a climber that is easy, moderate, and upright, then try Scent from Above. It makes a low-thorn-count pillar, that blooms all summer long.
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Reply #16 of 19 posted 28 JUL 14 by Rupert, Kim L.
That's very climate dependent, Michael. I planted Scent from Above three years ago. it is rather prickly, with very large, sharp thorns and flowers only the ends of 8' - 10' canes. I guess your colder, wetter, shorter season "keeps the lid" on it.
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Reply #17 of 19 posted 28 JUL 14 by Michael Garhart
Really? Odd. Its been the same way since I ever planted it. I dont even water it, lol.
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Reply #18 of 19 posted 28 JUL 14 by Rupert, Kim L.
You get rain. We honestly haven't had enough in three years to keep anything alive. You get something called "winter". Here, the deciduous trees don't lose their leaves and plants requiring "winter chill" refuse to flower. I had temps around Christmas in the eighties. If I don't water at least twice a week, things DIE. Literally. Even with that, nothing looks good and little is flowering.
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Reply #19 of 19 posted 28 JUL 14 by Michael Garhart
Come move here, lol :] Im just kidding, though. Most Cali's tend to sulk in the winter here. Its a rough transition for only being a state away.

You should try Rosa glutinosa. It seems to thrive better with neglect than with care. Its quite dwarf.
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Discussion id : 72-347
most recent 12 JUN 13 HIDE POSTS
 
Initial post 12 JUN 13 by Byrnes, Robert L.
I've paid my membership fee but am unable to view lineage information. Thank you.

Rob Byrnes
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