HelpMeFind Roses, Clematis and Peonies
Roses, Clematis and Peonies
and everything gardening related.
Simon Voorwinde
most recent 25 FEB SHOW ALL
Initial post 22 AUG 11 by Simon Voorwinde

This variety arose from controlled pollination of two unnamed seedlings. " :(

Reply #1 of 9 posted 22 JUN 12 by Vladimír Ježovič
It´s the same as parentage unknow.
Reply #2 of 9 posted 22 JUN 12 by Simon Voorwinde
It's not the same... the hybridiser would likely have a record of what the lineage of the un-named seedling was and it was the result of a planned cross. This might have been done to protect intellectual property rights or to disguise the lineage for marketting purposes.. for example it might detrimentally affect the sales of a rose in Australia if one was to advertise the fact that 'Rhapsody in Blue' was a parent of one of the seedlings as RiB in general does quite poorly here.
Reply #3 of 9 posted 27 JUN 12 by Margaret Furness
Rhapsody in Blue seems to be position-dependent - it does fine in my slightly acid clay soil, Mediterranean climate, zone 9b. On its own roots.
Reply #4 of 9 posted 30 JUN 12 by Simon Voorwinde
'Rhapsody in Blue' is own-root and on acid soil here as well; deep red soil. It's in a prime location. Every summer, without fail, it goes dormant and loses all its leaves only to make a new batch in autumn. It grows ok, if you can ignore this trait but its not really something I think Aussie gardeners are after as we spend a large proportion of our time outdoors in our gardens in summer. It's a nice colour, but I think it is completely unsuitable for Australian conditions. It's descendant, 'Wild Rover', is exactly the same down here.

P.S. did you get my email, Margaret, thanking you for the HRiA journals?
Reply #5 of 9 posted 1 JUL 12 by Margaret Furness
Yes, I did thanks - a bit hectic at present, hence the delayed reply!
Reply #7 of 9 posted 25 FEB by Kathy Strong's Del Cerro Garden
Rhapsody in Blue seems to be very temperature dependent, actually. I think it's the temperature above about 80 degrees Fahrenheit (27 degrees in Celsius) that induces a type of dormancy in that rose. I grew it in a marine fog bank in coastal SoCal and it did just great there all summer long at average temps of about 75, but moving it out of the fog bank and to areas just a few degrees warmer induced that summer dormancy thing it does, all in very similar soil types.
Reply #8 of 9 posted 25 FEB by Margaret Furness
It doesn't defoliate at all in my no-spray garden. Mediterranean climate, hot dry summers, occasionally above 100F / 38C. Not flowering at present (late summer) but I haven't deadheaded it. I would regard it as a robust rose, and am surprised to hear that others have problems with it.
Reply #9 of 9 posted 25 FEB by Michael Garhart
Stormy Weather loves heat, and you can prune it to stay as a shrub. I mean, if you like RiB but hate that it cries as soon as the sun comes out.
Reply #6 of 9 posted 24 FEB by Michael Garhart
Often times "seedling" is a known variety, or a simple cross of 2 known varieties. It's uncommon for a "seedling" to be a complex hybrid.

On rare occasion, unknown is known, but masked for protective reasons. But often is truly unknown. It's a real pain.

In quite rare cases, the seedling is not only known, but given or sold to a breeder by another breeder, and it is either masked or stated as their own unique lineage. This is more common from country to country, rather than within any given country.
most recent 24 FEB SHOW ALL
Initial post 4 JAN 14 by Simon Voorwinde
How's the health of this one, Michael?
Reply #1 of 4 posted 5 JAN 14 by Rosaholic's Southern California Garden
I can vouch for no powdery mildew on this one -- completely clean that way.
Reply #2 of 4 posted 6 JAN 14 by Michael Garhart
It seemed healthy enough. I don't know about its disease resistance, but the fade resistance is really great, and the plant looks way better than Julia Child. The vigor looked okay, too.

It does descend from two lines of roses that are known for soft wood and hating wet soils, but it seems fine so far. We will see.
Reply #3 of 4 posted 6 JAN 14 by Simon Voorwinde
'Julia Child' has been powdery mildew-proof here. It spots a little on the lower foliage and downy mildew has made its presence felt. If this one is an improvement on it that's a great thing. Have you tested its fertility (either way) yet? 'Julia Child' seems to set seed with most things. It's new here this year so I don't know how well its seeds germinate but given how often it has been used I can't see a problem there. It even worked with Harisonii pollen! This one (Sparkle & Shine) has just hit Australia and may be released in the next few years.
Reply #4 of 4 posted 24 FEB by Michael Garhart
It sets seed, and has been slightly winter tender, but fine enough. It actually smells good, which was surprising to realize.
most recent 15 FEB SHOW ALL
Initial post 8 NOV 09 by Simon Voorwinde
I suspect wichurana features somewhere in this variety... very double producing no anthers for me (Tasmania, Australia). Has not set any OP hips yet. Testing it as a seed parent this season. Grows easily and well on its own roots.
Reply #1 of 1 posted 15 FEB by Michael Garhart
"Comparison with Parents

`AUSgold` (Golden Celebration) has large, cupped, golden-yellow flowers on a medium shrub compared with the orange-red blooms of AUSjump. The seedling parent has deep pink flowers and grows to 240 cm, about thrice the height of AUSjump. "

8' tall?

I have Jubilee Celebration, which is either a full or half-sister to this rose. A resulting seedling with a typical HT resulted in a 7' floppy monster HT. Nothing even remotely like the very short Jubilee Celebration, or either parent of the HT.

My first thought was back-breeding to Aloha? Similar foliage. Who knows though.

It is quite weird, the reference to a polyantha line, because there is nothing to back this up, and the stated height of the unknown parent in the patent is pretty disparate to the polyantha idea.
most recent 11 FEB SHOW ALL
Initial post 19 JUN 10 by RosariumRob
According to Google-translated info on the website of the Chinese Plant Varieties Protection Information Network (, Immensee and Yellow Fleurette were involved in creating this rose. Someone who can read Chinese may be able to decipher the exact parentage reported.
Reply #1 of 5 posted 12 DEC 10 by Michael Garhart
"Note: Section Kyi is Immensee Kelvin female parent of hybrid seedlings with unknown seedlings, the male parent for the YELLOW FLEURETT."

I think it is saying Immense seedling x Yellow Fleurett, which makes sense in appearance. I am using Google Chrome btw. It has an auto translator installed. Still, it induces headaches, lol.
Reply #2 of 5 posted 17 SEP 11 by Simon Voorwinde

"Controlled pollination: Seed parent (seedling x ‘Immensee’), crossed with pollen parent (‘Korlalon’)."

Reply #3 of 5 posted 17 SEP 11 by jedmar
Parentage added, thank you. I wonder why the patents state alternative pollen parents with 'KORlalon' and 'Yellow Fleurette'.
Reply #4 of 5 posted 18 SEP 11 by Simon Voorwinde
I'm not sure it is. Maybe it's as Michael is saying and 'Yellow Fleurette' is involved in the breeding od the unknown seedling somehow.
Reply #5 of 5 posted 11 FEB by Michael Garhart
I think the miscommunication is in the translation and general wording. It is possible that the patent is implying that the male parent's male parent is Yellow Fleurette.

I think the patent is trying to imply that its new product is an improvement on the paternal grandfather.

But there is no way to prove this, but it's the best scenario I can see based on the clumsy translations.
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