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'Autumn Damask' rose Reviews & Comments
Discussion id : 93-066
most recent 19 MAY SHOW ALL
 
Initial post 29 MAY 16 by Joan E. Richardson
In an interview on July 13, 1948 printed in the Corpus Christi Caller Times, Anna Moore Schwien, a former slave speaks of her childhood during the Civil War in Corpus Christi. She relates "At that time there was only one rose bush Corpus Christi and it was called the Rose of Castile. It was pale pink and very fragrant. It grew on a great big bush in the yard of a woman named Trinidad who lived where the Perkins Brothers store was later.
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Reply #1 of 1 posted 19 MAY by Rosewild
I've been researching the Rose of Castile and unfortunately these historic comments never describe the flower, whether it was double or single petalled. Do you know if the Corpus Christi rose was double or single petalled?
Don
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Discussion id : 92-629
most recent 9 MAY 16 HIDE POSTS
 
Initial post 9 MAY 16 by AquaEyes
Today I noticed something interesting about my potted band of 'Quatre Saisons'. It had a few blooms which dropped their petals, but what remained on the plant still emitted a fragrance. Getting up close, I realized it was the stamens, and the scent they were wafting was that of cloves -- just like its R. moschata grandparent. This wasn't the resinous scent of the sepals -- clipping the stamens and holding them in my hand isolated the clove scent. Perhaps this feature wasn't noted previously because of the strong fragrance from the petals. And perhaps that spicy note of cloves is a "piece of the whole" which we call the "classic Damask scent".

:-)

~Christopher
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Discussion id : 88-528
most recent 5 OCT 15 HIDE POSTS
 
Initial post 5 OCT 15 by Salix
It is interesting that the hips have the same shape as Fedtschenkoana. They all seem to contain 1 giant nut of a seed(achene).
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Discussion id : 82-074
most recent 26 DEC 14 SHOW ALL
 
Initial post 16 DEC 14 by CybeRose
Montaigne (15 Nov 1580) - Montaigne arrived in Ferrara, Italy, where he saw "several beautiful churches, gardens, and private mansions, and everything that could be called notable—among the others, at the Jesuates', a specimen of a rose which blooms every month of the year; and indeed they found one which they gave to Monsieur Montaigne."
Dalechamps (1587) - Rosa Pestanae bifera
Ferrari (1633) - Rosa Italica flore subrubente perpetua (omnium mensium)
Hanmer (1659) - Rosa Italica = Monethly Rose
Rea (1665) - Rosa mensalis = The monethly Rose
Quintinye (1695) - Tous-les-Mois Rose = a sort of red Musk Rose
Liger (1706) - Rosa Omnium Calendarum, The Every Month Rose, Italian double and perpetual Rose.
Miller (1724) - Monthly and Cluster Monthly. Rosa omnium Calendarum or Italian double everlasting Rose.
Furber (1730) - White Monthly
Ehret (1740s) - Striped Monthly
Martyn (1807) - Red and White Monthly Roses
Pemberton (1920) - The earliest varieties of the Damask are supposed to be the Red Monthly and the White Monthly, both producing a second and even a third crop of flowers in favourable seasons.
REPLY
Reply #1 of 2 posted 25 DEC 14 by Hardy
I'm not quite sure what to think of Dalechamps on this subject, it seems like he's caught up in the old damask-musk confusion. After saying that cultivated and wild roses generally bloom in May and June, he says (Historia Generalis Plantarum, p. 118),
"Rosae Damascenae seu Moschatae etiam Maio, sed iterum Septembri mense, sive Autumno, quod nemini mirum videri debet, cum sint etiam Pestanae Rosae biferae Virgilio."

Per my awful Latin, this would be, roughly, "The Damask or Musk roses also in May, and again in September, or Autumn, which shouldn't come as a surprise, since it's also called the twice-bearing Paestan rose of Virgil."

The accompanying illustration of R. damascena (p. 115) looks like a thorny specimen of Single Musk. I have a hard time reaching any conclusion.
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Reply #2 of 2 posted 26 DEC 14 by CybeRose
Hardy,
Thanks for bringing this to my attention. I got my information from a micro-opaque (a positive print from a microfiche) back in 2001. Today I found it on-line and checked again.

I think you skipped a line. The "May and June" refers to "Rosae sativae & sylvestres". The "Rosae Damascenae seu Moschatae" bloomed in May, then again in September.

Rosa moschata, as I've seen it, continues flowering through the summer and autumn without a break. So, the twice-blooming rose he had in mind must have been closer to a damask in the modern sense.

Also, I think Dalechamps used "Moschatae" broadly to mean roses noted for their fragrance. He also mentioned the "elegantia Rosae Moschatae, vulgo Eglantier".

Finally, I'm glad to have a closer look at this book. Dalechamps wrote of "Luteae sylvestres sunt in Africa: sunt & Caeruleae in Hortis Italicis."

Compare this with Lobel (1576):
"Pares & cognatiores illis Luteas, cùm aliàs saepe vidimus Argiera Affricae ex Numidia, Galliae inquilinas factas: tum in Anglia consimiles, solerti manu in Genistae scapù insitas, unde colorem, odorem, viresque mutuantur novas. Est & iamdiu videre Caeruleae in hortis Italicis.”

I'm still trying to learn of some earlier sources. this "caeruleae" is obviously a misreading of "ceruleae"; the roses were red-orange (cerulea) not blue (caerulea). The original misreading occurred by the 12th century, because Muhammad Ibn al-Áwwam, writing in Arabic, also discussed yellow/blue and blue/yellow roses. His sources must have been written in Latin because the color confusion involves a single letter in that language.

Karl
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