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most recent 3 days ago HIDE POSTS
 
Initial post 5 days ago by Andrew from Dolton
This rose looks far more multiflora than hybrid musk.
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Reply #1 of 20 posted 4 days ago by Jay-Jay
Most/a lot of Musk hybrids do!
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Reply #2 of 20 posted 4 days ago by jedmar
Pemberton named them Hybrid Musks although they were descendants of 'Trier', a hybrid multiflora. 'Trier' itself has some Noisette in it, but is more Multiflora. The convention kept the term Hybrid Musk although it is misleading.
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Reply #3 of 20 posted 4 days ago by Andrew from Dolton
It grows like a giant version of some of my R. multiflora 'Minima' seedlings. I can't see any in R. moschata in it at all.
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Reply #4 of 20 posted 4 days ago by Jay-Jay
If You would like to have a Moschata hybrid, just buy Musquée sans Soucis!
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Reply #5 of 20 posted 4 days ago by Andrew from Dolton
I don't need to, a kind man from The Netherlands gave me some seedlings.
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Reply #6 of 20 posted 4 days ago by Jay-Jay
Ooooooooooooooops...
And how do they look and behave? Like a Moschata?
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Reply #7 of 20 posted 4 days ago by Andrew from Dolton
They have thinner stems than I would be expecting from a hybrid musk, but I am really only familiar with 'Felicia', 'Buff Beauty', 'Penelope', 'Cornelia', 'Wilhelm' and 'Prosperity', I suppose out of all of them they would be most like 'Prosperity'. I will have to wait until next year and see what the flowers are like.
Going back to 'Dinky,' it has almost no scent, I think a true hybrid musk should at least have some musk fragrance.
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Reply #8 of 20 posted 4 days ago by Jay-Jay
As Jedmar said... it is a Multiflora Hybrid (of Rosa multiflora Thunb. ), like most of the so-called hybrid Musks are (like Mr. Lens bred). And like Felicia, and I have a hunch, that the others You mentioned have no or almost no Musk blood too, but a Multiflora ancestry.
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Reply #9 of 20 posted 3 days ago by Andrew from Dolton
I never realised quite how tenuous the musk connection was.
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Reply #10 of 20 posted 3 days ago by Jay-Jay
When You look at Penelope, way back in the parentage tree, behind Desprez, You can actually find Rosa moschata Herrm. But what the unknown parentage is of the other used roses and/or seedlings???
There is a most interesting book about hybrid Musks written by Anne Velle with a Geneology tree of Hybrid- Moschata in it: ISBN: 978 90 209 9623 4
Maybe Anne Velle might be able/willing/so kind to upload that page... or the interested might buy this book!
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Reply #11 of 20 posted 3 days ago by Andrew from Dolton
Thank you for that Jay-Jay.
'Penelope' is one of my favourite roses, the bud clusters as the first blooms are just opening look quite moschata like. Apparently it is the only rose with pink hips, but I have never seen photographic evidence of this. Mine only ever manage a dullish orange.
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Reply #13 of 20 posted 3 days ago by Jay-Jay
Orange hips You mean and pink flower-buds?
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Reply #12 of 20 posted 3 days ago by Jay-Jay
I selected the best seedlings, potted them and later re-potted them twice in bigger and bigger pots whilst fertilizing them twice this season.
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Reply #14 of 20 posted 3 days ago by Andrew from Dolton
Graham Stuart Thomas says that 'Penenope' has pink hips.
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Reply #15 of 20 posted 3 days ago by Jay-Jay
A slip of the tongue?
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Reply #16 of 20 posted 3 days ago by Andrew from Dolton
Thomas wrote hips as heps, because of the reference to that part of a females' anatomy. He used the archaic English spelling shew/shews instead of show/shows.
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Reply #17 of 20 posted 3 days ago by Jay-Jay
No confusion over here, we call them "bottels" (not Bottles). But some hips look like bottles or are urn-shaped.
Never thought of that female anatomy in combination with the rose-fruits. Freud would have liked the use of language by Graham Stuart Thomas or his hesitation to use the word hip ;-)
And is the color rose/rosé (roze in Dutch) not in fact pink? Rose-hips wrongly transformed in pink hips?
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Reply #18 of 20 posted 3 days ago by Andrew from Dolton
It is from the same school of Victorian Englishness that once covered up piano and table legs in case they caused any erotic thoughts.
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Reply #19 of 20 posted 3 days ago by Jay-Jay
chuckle chuckle.
PS: I once formed/made an ax-handle, to have more grip, like a ladies-calf. No Victorian Duch-ness for me.
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Reply #20 of 20 posted 3 days ago by Andrew from Dolton
It's like the French say 'Cuisse de Nymphe' and the English 'Maiden's Blush'.
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GardenCatsrose
most recent 3 days ago HIDE POSTS
 
Initial post 4 days ago by pminor
love your garden!!! I see that you grow belle sans flatterie I have been searching for a source for this rose Can you advise me where you purchased yours?
Thanks!!
Pat
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Reply #1 of 4 posted 4 days ago by Catsrose
I got mine from Vintage Gardens, now defunct. It suckers wildly, so I'd be happy to send you cuttings.
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Reply #2 of 4 posted 3 days ago by pminor
That would be so cool! I am happy to reimburse postage.
Sounds like i could get some rooted material, makes it easier.
Thanks!!!
Pat minor
32 celeste ct
Novato ca 94947
I am so happy to find this rose!!
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Reply #3 of 4 posted 3 days ago by Catsrose
I assume you have already tried Friends of Vintage Gardens in Sebastopol and the Bay Area Heritage Rose Society. I'm in Virginia, but I'll be happy to send you some.
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Reply #4 of 4 posted 3 days ago by pminor
Vintage gardens is no longer in business of sales though friends of vintage gardens has preserved the collection. I have joined and get newsletter. But retail operations closed.
I am so grateful.
Thanks
Pat
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most recent 3 days ago HIDE POSTS
 
Initial post 3 days ago by Claire
Another follow up on this rose, four years after my last. I have not had much time for cultivation and have been away often in the summer as my parents needed me more. My roses had no water or care in summer and many of them died, only the Earthkind roses really going strong, and even Mutabilis gave up the ghost after Hurricane Harvey. The shade has increased in the spot where softee is planted, but softee increased with it, turning the corner of the house, sending out canes up to fourteen feet reaching for the light, crossing the fence and shrubbery to bloom on the sunside in the neighbors yard. Canes at the base are thick as my thumb. Never watered, lives in dry shade. This stress test replicates what Earthkind roses go through except for obvious reasons they are not typically given full shade. Rooted cuttings I took in 2013 also survived with minimal care in a pot. Now I've moved my mom here to a new house where I have a strip of sun along the south side. I brought the potted softee with me, and started to water it; it sent out a long root through the bottom of the pot before I got a chance to put it in the ground. I am not sure what I'm going to do with the mother plant, but it deserves a chance in a better location. This rose will survive anything, has been through transplant, flood, drought, and never gives up. The only trouble is finding a spot with consistent afternoon shade to protect the blooms.
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PhotoDemon
most recent 4 days ago HIDE POSTS
 
Initial post 4 days ago by NorthWestRider
Nice, that is a huge set of blooms. I use to have some however mine were Iceburg and did not make it through last winters...
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