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'Westerland' rose Reviews & Comments
Discussion id : 88-701
most recent 14 OCT 15 HIDE POSTS
 
Initial post 14 OCT 15 by rosegeek
I live in zone 9, it gets hot in the summer where I live and I have it planted in partial shade. Westerland is very disease resistant and grows tall but the blooms leave a lot to be desired, infrequent blooms that scorch in the heat. The blooms are very fragrant though, they make a good cut flower. I regret buying it for my location, Westerland is better suited along the coast or mountains where the temps don't get above 85F(29C).
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Discussion id : 74-554
most recent 28 JUL 14 SHOW ALL
 
Initial post 14 OCT 13 by Organic Roses-Honeybee Garden
Hi, my good friend in Europe is breeding the shrub Westerland and this is how I noticed an accidental mislabeling of the Climbing Westerland. In the U.S. Westerland is a very! popular Climber and it does climb on trellises and archways. Had another friend who used to post photos of his on trellises on an American forum. The description label has to be switched over to "climber" for this specific area . It still reads as "shrub". And maybe comments need to be separated out so that shrub comments remain with the shrub version and the climber remains with the climber version! Or if Lyn can make final clarifications so that people don't mix the 2 together. As a web designer, I know this may be a bit of a bear (American slang for major headache) to correct, but hopefully someone on the administrative side can sort this out. Description still reads as shrub for HMF's "Climbing Westerland" so I think that's why we might have all the mixup? But then I'm not positive either. I'm just thinking that U.S. breeders specifically bred for the climbing version because it makes such a great climber here in our locale and our climate and / or sunlight conditions.
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Reply #1 of 19 posted 15 OCT 13 by Rupert, Kim L.
There is no confusion between the shrub and climbing form. Depending upon climate, many roses will either grow as shrubs, or explode into climbing growth depending upon the heat, light, length of season and other resources. Many English roses as well as Sally Holmes do exactly the same thing in longer season climates. Even though you will sometimes find nurseries and articles listing "Cl. Westerland", "Cl. Sally Holmes", they are the same, exact roses. They are simply being described by how they have performed for those describing them. Take a look at the David Austin Catalog. He will list the same rose as being able to be grown as a shrub as well as grown as a climber. But, they are still the same, exact roses.
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Reply #2 of 19 posted 15 OCT 13 by Organic Roses-Honeybee Garden
Oh, cool! Thanks for explaining, Kim!
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Reply #3 of 19 posted 15 OCT 13 by Rupert, Kim L.
You're welcome!
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Reply #4 of 19 posted 15 OCT 13 by Organic Roses-Honeybee Garden
haha, I also take things very literal! You should see my NYC Botanical Garden photo comment here, lol, lol! I got confused when someone had moved a label and I could not! for the life of me figure out what rose it was. (smack the forehead) I was doing a whooooa this name does not look like this rose and Palustris had to say break down for me in simpler terms for this simpleton on what had happened to this rose bwaha....

http://www.helpmefind.com/gardening/l.php?l=21.230078&tab=32

Still curious as to what this rose is. Color reminds me of my friend's seedling but petal shape is completely different.... hmmmmm
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Reply #5 of 19 posted 15 OCT 13 by Rupert, Kim L.
From the photo, it appears to be some sort of rambler. It could be visually misleading and actually be a smaller, dwarf plant. It's hard to tell from the image. If the garden has a list of the roses they grow, check their ramblers listed as growing there. I think you may find the identity there.
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Reply #6 of 19 posted 15 OCT 13 by Organic Roses-Honeybee Garden
Definitely camera angle distortion. Plant is under 4' like your 2nd guess (smaller dwarf) because the grey in the background is actually gravel. Plant is also in center aisle which makes things even more hard to guess, because climbers and ramblers are positioned against the outer walls. I tried looking under all the Kordes since it's one of the most popular breeds for NYCBG it seems. But as you can tell no luck with that. Nothing yet seems to match. The way it's clustered I would normally guess floribunda and flowers look too modern to be a hybrid musk and hybrid musks tend to be massive plants (instead of dwarf-y like this one). But then quite a few hybrid musks have very elliptical leaves and this rose has elliptical leaves. And the leaves seem very small and delicate. Leaves should give a good hint since it's atypical, but I'm somewhat of an idiot when it comes to breed knowledge, lol! So my guess is getting further and further "off" I'm sure! OK it's super late here so will have to sleep, haha! or else I will make lots of mistakes and make my clients mad :P Need to leave the detective work to you (the wise experts) haha!
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Reply #8 of 19 posted 15 OCT 13 by Rupert, Kim L.
Is it possible the rose is something of the polyantha class? Britiannia, for one, can resemble this type and coloring of flower depending upon conditions. You might look at single, reddish polys to find an identity.
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Reply #9 of 19 posted 15 OCT 13 by Organic Roses-Honeybee Garden
Whoo-hoo, on the Sherlock Holmes perfect mystery solution!!!! Thanks, Kim!! it is a polyantha for sure! Had to Google since I don't get to see these types of roses where I live! but photo after photo shows this exact same leaf shape and bloom clustering!!!! And there are several smaller height polyanthas shown via Google versus larger polyanthas. So excited - am narrowing down to a few magenta ones!!!
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Reply #7 of 19 posted 15 OCT 13 by Jay-Jay
Hi organic R&B garden.
I planted Westerland to be a climber, but it behaved at the same time like a free standing shrub too!
...So people got grabbed by the vicious hooked prickles, when they got out of their car on our driveway, so I removed it to another spot. See my pictures of the same rose. Before and after planting.
Over here, I would recommend it as a free standing shrub.
On the other hand, the Rosarium of Winschoten grows Lichtkönigin Lucia (shares ancestry with Westerland) as a shrub (see my photo's of that in 2009) ...But at our place it's a very satisfying good climber.(see my photo's too). It doesn't spread and arch that much from its base as the Westerland does.
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Reply #10 of 19 posted 15 OCT 13 by Organic Roses-Honeybee Garden
Hi, Jay-Jay! Ha ha on the thorny grab! Kim mentioned the situation that Westerland is the exact same breed of roses but perform differently depending on locale.And I know in Europe the sun rays are less direct compared to the blasting rays of U.S. MIdwest and the majority of California. But! In general Westerland in U.S. is a climber and does not have the same issue as my Climbing America which seems destined to remain a spreading "shrub" because it cannot handle high BS, my lazy *ss neglect, and! our pendulum swinging winters. A gardener warned me that my Climbing America will forever remain a pathetic shrub and will not perform well. But hard-headed me loved it so much that I have two, lol! Poor roses!!! But who knows, I believe sometimes certain climbers are turtles in starting out slow then gathering momentum. Compassion took 4 years before it started to begin its climber status.... Not every climber is an immediate monster like Viking Queen. But! that being said I also have Climbing Etoile de Hollande, which is listed as a regular shrub too. Haha, the annoying "pest" me (who happens to grow E de H) will be curious as to whether "shrub" Etoile de Hollande is indeed the "same" plant as the "climbing" Etoile de Hollande". If so, this will be another thing I am learning, lol! I used to always think that both shrub and climber were bred out to favor one characteristic (the climber gene) versus the original shrub gene. Also Jay-Jay, I looove your Westie! Hmmm, once it settles with the transplant, maybe??? it will eventually transform to its climber status. It certainly seems vigorous and happy enough to. I would love to see it in 3 additional years and compare....
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Reply #11 of 19 posted 15 OCT 13 by Jay-Jay
There is a distinct Étoile de Hollande AND a distinct sport of it: Étoile de Hollande Climbing!
I grow both and one is the climbing rose and one is the normal sized HT, that stays short.
So this is different from what Kim told You about roses acting both as a shrub and as a climber. Like some of the Austins do too. (when trained as a climber)
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Reply #12 of 19 posted 15 OCT 13 by Organic Roses-Honeybee Garden
Lol, another (smack on the forehead) I should have remembered to look at the BREEDER!!!! this is the definite indicator! AAAARGH haha! Reading the plant's original breeder is the clue.
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Reply #13 of 19 posted 15 OCT 13 by Jay-Jay
No a smack on the back of Your head ; )
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Reply #14 of 19 posted 15 OCT 13 by Organic Roses-Honeybee Garden
Lol, same thing (backwards and forwards) Jay-Jay! and BTW I need to stop writing on HMF during the day, eeeee! I forgot how addicting Rose talk is after being away for a year! May I blame my stupid "forehead" on not getting my real-life deadlines finished???? Must end thread before more stupidity revealed hahaha!
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Reply #15 of 19 posted 28 JUL 14 by Michael Garhart
If you want an explosive, easy climber, then try Sympathie or Salita. If you want a climber that is easy, moderate, and upright, then try Scent from Above. It makes a low-thorn-count pillar, that blooms all summer long.
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Reply #16 of 19 posted 28 JUL 14 by Rupert, Kim L.
That's very climate dependent, Michael. I planted Scent from Above three years ago. it is rather prickly, with very large, sharp thorns and flowers only the ends of 8' - 10' canes. I guess your colder, wetter, shorter season "keeps the lid" on it.
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Reply #17 of 19 posted 28 JUL 14 by Michael Garhart
Really? Odd. Its been the same way since I ever planted it. I dont even water it, lol.
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Reply #18 of 19 posted 28 JUL 14 by Rupert, Kim L.
You get rain. We honestly haven't had enough in three years to keep anything alive. You get something called "winter". Here, the deciduous trees don't lose their leaves and plants requiring "winter chill" refuse to flower. I had temps around Christmas in the eighties. If I don't water at least twice a week, things DIE. Literally. Even with that, nothing looks good and little is flowering.
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Reply #19 of 19 posted 28 JUL 14 by Michael Garhart
Come move here, lol :] Im just kidding, though. Most Cali's tend to sulk in the winter here. Its a rough transition for only being a state away.

You should try Rosa glutinosa. It seems to thrive better with neglect than with care. Its quite dwarf.
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Discussion id : 72-347
most recent 12 JUN 13 HIDE POSTS
 
Initial post 12 JUN 13 by Byrnes, Robert L.
I've paid my membership fee but am unable to view lineage information. Thank you.

Rob Byrnes
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Discussion id : 66-199
most recent 24 MAY 13 SHOW ALL
 
Initial post 3 AUG 12 by Bini
hello, my name is Bini, I´m from germany. ours is a 6b climat. I´d like to share with you why "Westerland"is my favorit rose and why, if I would be allowed to have only one rose in my garden, it sure would be "Westerland".
"Westerland" was among the first roses I ever got, 15 years back, when I was looking for tall, blooming plants to set along a fence towards the street. I don´t even remember why I got it, because then I was in my " pink phase" .
I put it in our heavy clay ground with lots of composted horse manure and just watched it grow. within 2 years it had metamorphosed into a 2.50m high, almost 2 m wide bloom-monster. if you dead-head it, it blooms. if you don´t, it sets hips and blooms, if you feed it, it blooms, if you forget, it blooms.if it gets blackspots in moist years, it shakes off those spotted leaves and blooms. and along with the many blooms comes a fragrant.... so strong and wonderful...
I´ve seen pedestrians stop dead in their tracks, or come over from the other side of the street, just do burry ther noses in my "Westerland".
I´ve been ask so many times about her name and whereabouts, that I actually thought about putting a name tack outside of the fence, but then I would have missed all those little talks. Many could just not resist and nicked a bloom from her, but neither my "Westerland" nor I did mind, we understood eachother as ambassadors of roses.
Her color was a truly strong orange, more yellow in the middle, in hot weather or as the days went by the blooms brightend into lighter colors, some even into soft baby-rosè with a yellow center. the blooms stayed on the shrub long, and if you where lazy turning into big green hips. she started doing her blooming-thing in mid-june until father frost send her to sleep.
Last winter we had an freakish warm january, followed by 6 weeks of dry, bitter frost.It took about half of all my roses. old or young, protected or not,monsters and petits all the same.And it took my "Westerland".
maybe you already know how it feels to take a saw to the corps of a plant you really liked....
I left the roots in, because I did not want to do damage to the neighboring plants in springtime bringing out the roots big as the ones of trees.
I went an got a new "Westerland", putting it near the old, familiar spot.
Next thing I know was fat, big fingers with rubired foilage on top reaching out of the ground on my first "Westerland" grave. I was so proud of my old girl !
now they are blooming side by side along my fence, making me happy just by looking at them. I can´t wait for them to reach maturity and call out for worshippers up and down the street.
I firmly belive, if every gardeners first rose would be a "Westerland" there would be more rose-lovers.
Bini.
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Reply #1 of 2 posted 3 AUG 12 by Lyn G
Bini...

What you have experienced is similar to what I have had happen during my rose life. The roses continue to surprise me with their determination to live.

Smiles,
Lyn
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Reply #2 of 2 posted 24 MAY 13 by WarGar
I found 'Westerland' abandoned in a 1 gallon pot with about 1/2 gallon worth of soil, still alive but struggling. I potted it up into a very large pot (about 15 gallons) to see what would happen. It has now had about a year to settle in and is blooming like crazy. Like Bini says, people stop and want to know what this rose is! I am making cuttings to give to people and sharing stories like Bini's, which is all you need to know about any rose.
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