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Cà Berta
most recent 28 JAN HIDE POSTS
 
Initial post 26 JAN by Cà Berta
Very likely this rose is Supercandy the rose that in the International Rose Trial of Monza in 1966 was awarded the title of best italian rose. Supercandy was a name strongly linked to Niso Fumagalli, the patron of the event and owner of the Candy appliance company.

PS Supercandy still exists in Roseto San Giovanni, Trieste and definitly differs from Mongioia. You can see its photo in the web site Il Nuovo Cercapiante
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Reply #1 of 2 posted 27 JAN by Nastarana
Ca Berta, would you know if Mansuino used an American rose named 'Ivory Triumph' in his breeding? I ask because 'Mongioia' looks rather like IT with more petals. I believe that some of von Abrams roses did find their way to Europe.
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Reply #2 of 2 posted 28 JAN by Cà Berta
I am not expert of breeding but I think it unlikely becouse of the too close years of introduction in two very far away part of the world and becouse, as far as I know, Ivory Triumph was not commercially introduced in Italy.
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most recent 6 JAN SHOW ALL
 
Initial post 30 DEC 13 by andrewandsally
Interesting. The current (3rd) edition of 'Sublime Rosa' gives the date of 'Dolcezza' as 2010. I suspect that Rose Barni don't give obtention dates but catalogue dates, since the same entry states that 'Dolcezza' won the Medal of Beauty at Barcelona in 2008.
Incidentally, the same page lists the variety 'Broccato' as one of their Toscana line, old style HTs, but you don't list it.
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Reply #1 of 13 posted 30 DEC 13 by Cà Berta
With BARNI roses is very difficult to understand what is going on ....
The only reference for Dolcezza in HMF (Sublime rosa 2004) reports as breeding date 1987. I have a few BARNI catalogues of the '90s and in fact there is listed a Dolcezza (Barni 1986 Bardolc). In recent BARNI catalogues it is listed a Dolcezza (Barni 2010 Bardolc).
The two roses may or may not be the same. However, according to Barni catalogues, they differ in height 120-140 cm the old and 70-90 the new one. Besides, as the new Dolcezza had a recent award in Barcellona, it can not be the old one..
A possible explanation is that Barni registers the same trademark for different roses (see also a comment for Briosa)

Dolcezza

Italy - TM No 1027320 on 6 November 2006
Application on 23 October 2002
Renewal
Italy - TM No 1504572 on 16 August 2012
Application on 24 July 2012
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Reply #2 of 13 posted 19 AUG 14 by Cà Berta
Here are the data of the registration of the trademark for the first Dolcezza, that was not renewed 10 years later.
Dolcezza
Italy – TM No 500334 on 11 November 1988
Application on 2 October 1987

Strangerly enough the application of the trademark for the second Dolcezza was on 23 October 2002, well ahead both of the Barcelona Price (2008) and the catalogue date (2010). This trademark was renewed on 16 August 2012
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Reply #3 of 13 posted 4 JAN by nobaranobara
This rose is planted in ‘Flower Festival Commemorative Park’. It is a rose that has been replicated from the ‘Carla Fineschi Foundation Rose Garden’.
Of the two varieties with the same name, I got a rose from a Serbian farm, which seems to be new release.
This rose had the impression that AUSblush or its immediate offspring was used for breeding.The leaves, flowers and fragrance were just that.
Upload an image of an old version of the rose planted in ‘Flower Festival Commemorative Park’.
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Reply #4 of 13 posted 4 JAN by jedmar
It seems clear that we are dealing with two different 'Dolcezza'. I have added a detailed reference for the original 1986 'Dolcezza' at Carla Fineschi and Flower Festival Commemorative Park. The rose in commerce now is different and was apparently intoduced 2010. It is not unusual that Trademarks are applied for before the rose is issued. If Barni had the intention to recycle the Name and issue a new 'Dolcezza', they would have known well in advance and possibly the seedling already existed in 2002.
As a result, we have now two 'Dolcezza' listed with the appropriate photos and other information.
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Reply #5 of 13 posted 4 JAN by nobaranobara
Thank you for your comment.
This rose of 1987, the fragrance is none to mild only feel green apple.
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Reply #6 of 13 posted 4 JAN by Cà Berta
In the taxonomic catalogue of Roseto Botanico Gianfranco e Carla Fineschi at Cavriglia the 1987 Dolcezza is reported to be located next to Garisenda. I happened to have a photo of these two close roses ... I might load it, although there is no label and thus I am not definitly sure of it being Dolcezza.
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Reply #7 of 13 posted 5 JAN by nobaranobara
Thank you for your comment.
The photo you uploaded looks like 'Dolcezza (1987)'.
I feel it just like the roses, planted in the ‘Flower Festival Commemorative Park’.
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Reply #8 of 13 posted 5 JAN by Cà Berta
Next time I go to Roseto Fineschi I will check the label to confirm that it is the mather plant from which the graft material was taken.
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Reply #9 of 13 posted 5 JAN by nobaranobara
Thank you for your comment.
It is a dream garden that I would like to visit ‘Carla Fineschi Foundation Rose Garden’.
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Reply #10 of 13 posted 5 JAN by jedmar
"Rampicante" as mentioned in Theatrum Rosarum!
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Reply #11 of 13 posted 5 JAN by Cà Berta
It is located in a "rampicante" bed but in the recent taxonomic catalogue is listed as "shrub" ... and it looks "shrub"!!
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Reply #13 of 13 posted 6 JAN by jedmar
Yes, that's why it is listed as a shrub, but with the comment that it can be trained as a climber, as in the photo
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Reply #14 of 13 posted 6 JAN by nobaranobara
At the ‘Flower Festival Commemorative Park’ in Japan, this rose grows into a shrub, about 1.5m x 1.5m.
Blooms in flushes throughout the season.
I think this rose can be used for cut flower, climbing on short fences and pillars.
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most recent 6 JAN HIDE POSTS
 
Initial post 6 JAN by Cà Berta
The colour does not match at all with that of the two Dolcezza depicted in Barni catalogues and the colour of the Dolcezza(s) that can be admired in San Giovanni garden in Trieste and in Fineschi garden in Cavriglia
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most recent 14 NOV SHOW ALL
 
Initial post 17 MAY 13 by Unregistered Guest
Available from - Rose Barni
www.rosebarni.it
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Reply #1 of 2 posted 16 JAN 14 by Cà Berta
I confirm that a Belle Epoque (Christensen) Chriscinn is listed in Barni Catalogues since autumn 2011.
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Reply #2 of 2 posted 14 NOV by Chirotteri
Listed as HT
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