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Found an unidentified rose yesterday. The only extra information about the bush is that it grows near where the woman who runs the cafe lives. I forgot to ask about growth habit (yes, will ask).
However, I think it is likely to be a sizeable bush. Her comment makes me think it's protruding past the property boundary and she just nicked some, or it possibly has gone feral in a paddock.
So probably a fairly decent size, and durable on its own in the subtropics.
There is a distinct and very pleasant rose scent, with sugary/sweet notes but not at all sickly. Not a "pong out the whole room" scent, but very noticeable once you get close.
Blooms in clusters. Blooms are approximately 45 mm in diameter. Petals have a bit of a white centre once you open a bloom up. Stamens are very short and a nondescript brown.
Prickles are small (around 6mm) and hooked, at least on the cut arrangement I saw yesterday. Forgot to ask about the base of the canes. Quite sparse.
Any suggestions for what to start searching?
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My kneejerk reaction was Paul's Scarlet, which does repeat a bit, and is a survivor. Not known for scent, but worth looking at. Marie Nabonnand has much better scent but is mostly thornless, and hasn't been around in Aus as long. Its buds may help distinguish it.
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Paul's Scarlet definitely looks similar.
The buds on this mystery rose are almost spherical. Well at least, the one bud I happen to have at the moment is. That one's quite green though, so I should go see the bush itself.
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I don't recognise it but noticed the fairly coarse leaf serrations and that round little bud.
Will be interesting to get your impressions of the bush.
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I went and checked out the actual bushes. Turns out there's a dozen or two of them, and they aren't hanging over any fences. That'll teach me to make assumptions.*
Anyway, they turn out to be quite small bushes, around 70 cm (28") high. Spreading form, more or less. I saw them as they currently are, but was told they throw out quite long canes at times (which most roses will do when the mood takes them).
I was also told it seems to be repeat-flowering, for most of the year (sub-tropical climate) as far as she can recall. Pedicels are slightly bristly, but do not bite.
I don't know how long they have been there, but looking at the retaining wall blocks I'm guessing somewhere around the 20 year mark. So, this mystery beastie is probably a floribunda that was reasonably popular in the 1990's.
I'm going to contact the local garden club, as they may know which variety it is (it's planted in the cemetery grounds at Bangalow).
Photos of various bits and pieces are attached.
*Actually it probably won't, but you never know.
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#5 of 15 posted
30 JAN 20 by
 HubertG
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I don't know what it is, but that looks like mosaic virus affecting some of the leaves in the second photo. You might want to be careful what you bring back to your own garden.
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Whoops, I'll back off re Paul's Scarlet; unlikely to have been planted in a row. Next wild guess: Orange Triumph (Orange in the name is for Holland, not for colour).
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Yes I spotted that. Definitely something to be wary of.
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I feel that the rose is not the more rounded leafed 'Orange Triumph', but instead may be a member of the more elliptical leafed 'Orleans' tribe. Look closely at the stipule of your foundling.
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Here are some pics of 'Orange Triumph' budded from the hedge in Ethel Street, Guildford (Perth).
Two plants from the same budstick and on this day, one was producing flowers that were less full than the other. It was just a curiosity of the day and not a consistent character of those plants.
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The leaves on the Bangalow rose are definitely not as round as the ones shown in Billy's photos. Much more elongated.
*goes to look for "Orleans" tribe"*
ETA: Similarities there, but it's not 'Orléans Rose', or Koster's sport or 'Maréchal Foch', as all of those have wrinkly leaves (rugose, for the posh types) and this critter has smooth ones.
'New Orleans' doesn't match for scent (not enough shots available to tell much else).
I'm just digging though everything tagged as "polyantha". The Bangalow beastie could pass for 'Eutin' if you squint at it sideways. Colour of 'Eutin' is more towards red while "BB" more towards carmine-pink, but otherwise seems to be a close match. 'Eutin' is still in commerce in Australia.
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Ok, have been through all 63 pages of small thorny things tagged as polyantha, and have looked at anything that the thumbnail indicated might be in the right colour range. Can't find an exact match that jumps out at me, which probably means I'm missing something.
It's unlikely that "BB" is not listed, but quite a lot of them are missing photos, and frankly some of the photos of "the same rose" show so much variation that I'm wary of trusting them all, so it might (possibly) be one of the polyanthas that I have checked out.
ETA: Aha. There's a 'Pink Eutin' sport of 'Eutin'. No record of it being in Australia, but interesting in that it indicates a variant in the right colour range. Didn't find it at first because it's tagged as Floribunda rather than Polyantha. I suppose I'll have to go through all the floridbundles now.
Also went back and checked out every photo for 'Eutin', and some of those appear show a similar colour range, although obviously I can't be sure how accurate they are for colour. But still, 'Eutin' or a variant is looking closest at the moment.
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#12 of 15 posted
1 FEB 20 by
Plazbo
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The current understanding by those who've researched it is that it's spread is via grafting/budding on to infected rootstock and doesn't appear to spread from insect or cutting tools. So....may not be risk, just a defect of the plant and it's prior culture/care.
Having said that, when I get newly released roses from the larger sellers and they show RMV (sadly that outcome isn't unusual), I have to question the accuracy of what was studied, if the rose came into Australia already infected or if it's the norm for things to be budded onto infected rootstock.
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You can find those who will argue until blue in the face that it is easy to spread RMV via various odd and weird ways. Ralph Moore, who owned and operated Sequoia Nursery in Visalia, CA for 70 years (1937 - 2007) stated he had never been able to spread it any other way than budding/grafting, and he had TRIED. The roses you have received infected with RMV could either have been imported already infected, or the stock upon which they were budded there was infected. If they were US imports, particularly of roses created prior to the early 1990's, they very likely were already infected when imported there. RMV was a large issue with the US rose industry for decades. It is still not uncommon to find infected plants in nurseries here.
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#14 of 15 posted
3 FEB 20 by
Plazbo
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I suspect its a domestic propagation issue to some extent, its hard to account for a Kordes bred this century to have it but every now and then Madame Annisette has the yellow squiggle pattern on some leaves. There is a lot of the 90's USA stock too (ie Gemini, Honey Bouquet) which is expected. Its kordes and uk bred roses from this century that leave me questioning where the issue is.
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It's been estimated that by the late 1980's, upwards of 80% of the US production was infected. By the time the US producers began to honestly admit there was a problem, their fortunes were already dwindling and a short few years later they began bankrupting and being bought out by even less professional and accomplished owners. In all those decades, from the 1920's when RMV symptoms were first written of in the ARS annuals as "Infectious Chlorosis in Roses", through the 1990's, we passed RMV around the world MANY times. There are a number of contract producers remaining in the US which are continuing to infect new varieties as well as simply push out already infected types. I'm fairly confident similar situations exist in Australia, too, perhaps in Europe? I don't know. I haven't read complaints of RMV infection in Europe, which doesn't mean it doesn't exist, simply that I haven't read of it.
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