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Here in South Africa, Leonidas is said to be quite touchy about its care, being a florists' rose, & is hard to acquire for the garden. My one planted last year has thrown up a few absolutely exquisite blooms (even to giving me florists' colour in the autumn with the cooler temperatures) but has not proven to be a strong grower, despite getting the same care, sun, compost, mulch, fertiliser, spraying & water as the others that are getting quite carried away with themselves & have to be hacked back periodically. We are not in an especially hot or dry area of South Africa.
Are there any tips as to what Leonidas really, really wants in life?
I have just bought another one from a different source just in case the original is just not a happy camper in general.
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#1 of 6 posted
3 DEC 07 by
Unregistered Guest
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This one has truly beautiful blooms, and mine has the most novel coloration in the early spring and fall when temperatures are cooler (as does Hot Cocoa). When I got my plant, the nurseryman said it was "not a beginner's rose" and needed a lot of care (by which he meant disease control). Mine hasn't taken off either. It is definitely hurt his year by downy mildew, which is especially bad in my area this year. I think it's just not a particularly robust rose, but I'd love to be proven wrong!
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Thank you both for sharing your experience with HMF.
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We've been growing this rose for at least 5 years in my mom's east San Diego, California garden, and we now have 3 of them, as I also thought "we must've got a bad specimen" twice. Leonidas is just not a strong grower here either, and it is the first rose in the garden to get mildew and rust, both. And we do spray with the exhibitor's routine of exotic spray materials. That's what the nursery guy meant when he said "it's not a beginner's rose." It's definitely NOT "set if and forget it." And none of the three plants have ever had more than one or two surviving basal canes at any one time.
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Despite the introducers' claims that Leonidas is a good garden rose for virtually any garden in the Los Angeles area a few years ago in rose society meetings, this rose is one which was chosen specifically for its performance under glass. Those wonderful colors only appear when temperatures and duration of light are tightly controlled, or when your outdoor conditions closely replicate them. It is NOT a strong grower under most garden conditions and, in my experience, in an area where disease is not usually problematic, it does require chemical intervention to be anywhere near "acceptable". I love the odd colors and jumped at the chance to grow Leonidas when it first became available. It languished here for two years until I delighted in cutting the plants up for the trash.
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A friend of the abbey gave me Leonidas about 7-8 years ago, and I was not happy. I knew it to be a touchy, weak grower, and I didn't want that color anyway in a garden that largely featured pale Teas and English roses. I put it in a spot on a hill, out of the way, and ignored it, except that I fed it like the rest of the roses, gave it periodic watering, and didn't really prune it in January. I must say, after year 5, it started putting out thick basal canes, and is vigorous now. It blooms a lot, and is garden worthy - it just took a long time. It is a rose that likes plenty of compost and regular feeding with good deep watering every week or so. I was very surprised at how it took off. It is mildew prone in the climate I live in, but not too badly. Overall, Leonidas has been a nice surprise in the garden here.
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#6 of 6 posted
8 AUG 17 by
 jmile
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I think that you hit the nail on the head when you said that you don't pamper this rose. Mine grows big and healthy too. I water deeply every 2+ weeks. I throw horse stall and chicken droppings on this and others of my roses sporadically when I clean up after the animals. There is a mixture of alfalfa, wood shavings and pine needles also in the waste mixture. We are very hot and humidity is usually in the 20's. I do not spray my roses. This roses survives just fine when others die. We had irrigation problems last year when our Irrigation District lost some of their old old concrete pipes. This and other of my roses spent August and September without water. It survived when others did not.
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Not a pretty rose at all in my garden. The blooms are small, ugly, and bright magenta. Iceberg is a standout, I had higher expectations of Burgundy Iceberg.
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A primary issue with this rose is finding the right colour. It will range from a paler pinky shade, often having an attractive "water-colour" effect of dark pink/burgundy painted on white, through magenta as you have experienced, into the burgundy-red & then into a stunning deep royal purple (my favourite). You have to only buy when it is in bloom to ensure that you are getting the shade of "burgundy" that you want. I had the ultimate deep rich tone on a standard until a freak wind gust caught it. Unbeknownst to me, the top tie had become undone & the whole wonderful candelabra broke off below the graft. I almost cried, as that shade is so hard to come by.
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#2 of 8 posted
11 MAY 12 by
Kit
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The color on 'Burgundy Iceberg' seems to vary a lot with temperature & UV - mine are generally deep rich purple from late October to mid-July, but are indeed a very bright almost fluorescent magenta from August to October, and intermittantly in the Spring during high UV days (a potted shrub moved into the shade doesn't turn magenta). All the flowers on the shrub can turn that magenta in less than a day - I need to take a before and after picture to post. In the spring, the ones that have changed color remain magenta, but new buds will open purple again
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Well, you have to take into account that Burgundy Ice is a sport of a sport of a sport, originating in a pure white rose. A stunning fact in itself. So, one probably shouldn't be too surprised when the bloom colour recurs in some way to the former sport's colours (brilliant pink and pink, respectively).
I bought my Burgundy Ice when in bloom, and her blooms are of the darkest rich burgundy purple, their luminosity enhanced even more by the near-black stamens. It's so beautiful it nearly brings me to tears.
You should not hesitate to replace your specimen with another Burgundy Ice. When she shows her true colour, I guarantee you will fall in love with her.
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#4 of 8 posted
17 SEP 14 by
Kit
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Tante Rosa . . .
It's not a question of resporting - it's the response of the color producing cells to ultraviolet light. In Michelle's high altitude Colorado garden, she can expect to get the magenta color consistently, and sadly may go years without ever seeing a burgundy blossom. Her season is short and marked by intense UV.
My problem with this rose is leaf senility - we have a 48 week growing season here, but the leaves last no more than 10 or 11 weeks in direct sunlight, so from June to January (dormant season here is February) I'm plucking off dying leaves every few weeks.
If one doesn't mind the orange with purple effect, it does well in the dappled shade of a pomegranate or other such open tree with a very short leafless season - our pomegranates get new leaves within 3 to 7 weeks of defoliating, Under one, leaves on Burgundy Iceberg can last up to 5 months.
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This is very interesting. Another factor to consider when assessing rose colour.
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#6 of 8 posted
18 SEP 14 by
Kit
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Remember, there is no gene that codes for white pigment - white roses are pigmented with reds (most commonly) or purples but have their color production inhibited.
Here, Iceberg (as do other 'white' roses) becomes mottled with pink after a few days of intense sunlight, the result of the inhibitors breaking down and the newly liberated chromatophores pumping out a little bit of color at the very tail end of their lives.
Burgundy Iceberg has chromataphores for both red and purple, as did Iceberg. When the red inhibitor failed to activate, Pink Iceberg was born, the additional failure of the purple inhibitor created Burgundy Iceberg, expressing pigments that were coded for all along.
The majority of my deeper purple roses (e.g. Ebb Tide, Violetta, Diamond Eyes) have a more magenta expression under hot and high UV conditions,
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#7 of 8 posted
18 SEP 14 by
Kit
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I uploaded some pictures taken this morning of magenta shifted roses - see Diamond Eyes, Midnight Blue, Night Owl & Rhapsody in Blue.
The first three generally are deep purple, the last a purplish steely blue.
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Thank you so much! I know Rhapsody in Blue (neighbours have it), so it's stunning to see it in that colour. In our climate, it's cold blueish purple.
Also, thanks for the explanation of white in roses. Would the oppression of red also explain why white roses get pink spots after the rain? Because these freckles have always been a mystery to me. Are there white roses them that don't get them? I don't mind , just curious. And you seem to know a lot *smiles*
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Where have the "My Garden" plant listings gone?
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In South Africa, this rose has "Kempton Park" as a synonym.
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