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I think there is a mixup of two rose species.
Rosa farreri Stapf ex Cox (1915)
A species in the sect. Pimpinellifoliae (ser. Spinosissimae) with axillary, solitary pink or white flowers, with no bracts supporting the flowers.
Rosa persetosa Rolfe (193) is a species in the sect. Rosa (formerly sect. Cinnamomeae) with several red flowers in a corymb. The flowers are supported by 3–5 bracts. Rosa elegantula Rolfe is a synonym.
What may have caused the mixup is that there is a formae descripted of R. farreri, named f. persetosa Stapf.
These are two entirely different roses.
best wishes,
Ulf Eliasson
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'Culta' has white flowers.
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There seems to be two different roses here.
The old illustrations together with photos from Margaret Furness and Cass seems to represent one type, possibly the original 'Polyantha Grandiflora'.
Most of the other ones fit Rosa cerasocarpa.
Any comments on this?
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#1 of 2 posted
31 DEC 13 by
 jedmar
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Please note that R. cerasocarpa is not an accepted taxon. It is not listed in "Flora of China" or other newer sources. The naming sees to have occurred based on one or very few specimens, and not a broad study on site.
Rosa gentiliana Lév. & Van is seen today as a synonym of R. multiflora var. cathayensis.
Rosa gentiliana Rehd. & Will. is subsumed under Rosa henryi Boulenger.
Graham Thomas himself has admitted that he distributed 'Polyantha Grandiflora' mistakenly as R. gentiliana, although he does not state which R. gentiliana.
I would therefore not make a large issue of small differences in photos, until botanists have made further studies in China. It is more probable that a known cultivar, i.e. 'Polyantha Grandiflora' was distributed widely in commerce than obscure species.
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#2 of 2 posted
1 JAN 14 by
Tessie
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I do not know much about this rose but recently bought two young plants in 4 inch pots from Colvos Creek Nursery, http://www.colvoscreekdesigns.com/catalog-2/catalog-q-z/ which specializes in drought tolerant plants for the northwest. The possibility of drought tolerance here, where our droughts are likely more intense, was enough for me to give this rose a try. They were huge upon arrival (in October) for that size pot. So big that the canes had to be wrapped around the inside of the box. The nursery owner discounted them because he said they'd been munched on by deer. Only thing missing was some foliage. Even so they looked really good. I transferred them to 1 gallon pots and both have taken off. Foliage is a nice shade of green and completely healthy so far in rust and mildew heaven. From what I've seen so far, this rose is eager to climb.
I'll take some more pictures soon (but they may already be dormant like most of my roses), so I may wait until new foliage appears.
The photo below show the two Polyantha Grandifloras along with two plants of Rosa cantabrigiensis (the shorter, leafier ones).
Melissa
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I belive that all the photos show Rosa cerasocarpa or maybe 'Polyantha Grandiflora' except the illutration of Léveillé. The original description of Rosa gentiliana is different with semidouble flowers and very cuneate leaflets. The colour of the flowers is not mentioned which could point to that it was drawn from a harbarium specimen.
The illustration of Léveillé (from Catalogue illustré et alphabetique des plantes du Seu Tchouen, t. 58. 1918) show the cuneate leaves, but the plant in this illustration seems to have single flowers.
Original text:
"Planta recta, flexuosa nec scandens; folia glabra, 3-7-foliolata; foliola valde cuneata, dentibus argutis e basi ad apicem crescentibus munita, abrupte et brevissime caudata; flores mediocres, semiduplices; sepala tomentosa, dorso tamen medio glabrescentia, integerrima, eglandulosa; styli glabri, in columnam coaliti.......
Plante du groupe arvensis, tres remarquable par la forme en ecusson. "
My poor translation:
"Plant straight, curved or climbing. Leaves glabrous, 3-7-trifoliate. Leaves very cuneate, sharp teeth from the base to the tip, which abruptly end in a short tail.
Flowers moderate, semi-double.
Sepals tomentose, but glabrescent on the back, entire, without glands throughout.
Styles glabrous united in a column.
Arvensis plant group, very remarkable for the shape of the leaflets."
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Thank you Ulf.
I've deleted my photo that I had in 'Gentiliana'.
Léveillé's 1918 illustration of the leaves was particularly telling. I am not sure that it would have been exactly botanically accurate as the bottom leaves seem rather weird. The top leaves I could accept as being a rose leaf.
I've contacted the Victoria State Rose Garden about their photo.
That now leaves David Elliott and Peter (in Switzerland) to move or delete their photos.
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#2 of 4 posted
31 DEC 13 by
jedmar
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On the other hand, it is good to see the rose it is confused with, and where.
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Good morning to you Jedmar - and may we all have a 2014 as rewarding a year as was 2013.
I take your point. But perhaps it was the two glasses of bubbly pink stuff last night that is really muddling my mind this morning. I am going to make a foundling file for my rose and call it "113 R. gentiliana".
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#3 of 4 posted
31 DEC 13 by
jedmar
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Please note that R. cerasocarpa is not an accepted taxon. It is not listed in "Flora of China" or other newer sources. The naming sees to have occurred based on one or very few specimens, and not a broad study on site.
Rosa gentiliana Lév. & Van is seen today as a synonym of R. multiflora var. cathayensis.
Rosa gentiliana Rehd. & Will. is subsumed under Rosa henryi Boulenger.
Graham Thomas himself has admitted that he distributed 'Polyantha Grandiflora' mistakenly as R. gentiliana, although he does not state which R. gentiliana.
I would therefore not make a large issue of small differences in photos, until botanists have made further studies in China. It is more probable that a known cultivar, i.e. 'Polyantha Grandiflora' was distributed widely in commerce than obscure species.
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