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'Crimson China Rose' Reviews & Comments
Discussion id : 129-466
most recent yesterday HIDE POSTS
 
Initial post yesterday by CybeRose
The references of 1732, 1747, indicating that Monthly roses similar to the Province were already in China may refer to the rose we still call Autumn Damask. It was already being distributed in the 16th century. When Aublet reached Mauritius in 1752, he found a very old specimen that no longer flowered. The owner got it from Brazil.
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Discussion id : 129-465
most recent yesterday HIDE POSTS
 
Initial post yesterday by CybeRose
Rosa indica L. was based on a specimen of Rosa cymosa Tratt. in Petiver's collection.
"11. Rosa CHUSAN. glabra, Juniperi fructu. This Rose I have received both from Chusan and China, but not with Fruit, till Dr Sloan was pleas'd to give it to me."

As Lindley (1820) wrote:
"It is now, perhaps, too late to inquire what was really intended by Linnaeus for R. indica, since his specific character and description will agree with no species from China at present known; and the figure of Petiver which he quotes to this, in which he is followed by Willdenow, belongs to a widely different plant, very nearly allied to R. Banksiae, and which I have called R. microcarpa. I have, however, examined his specimen, which I see no reason to doubt belonging to this species. The specimen which Sir James Smith considers to have been the foundation of R. sinica I have also been permitted to see, and I feel little hesitation in pronouncing it to be a monstrous state of the species before us. The stipulae are narrow, pointed and finely toothed at the edge; the prickles are straight, very slender and unequal, which may be reasonably expected on R. indica in so weak a state as this R. sinica evidently is. That name, therefore, becomes disengaged, and I have retained it for the plant which was distinguished by it in Hortus Kewensis."

If Lindley had looked around a bit he might have noticed that Dr. Fothergill had Rosa indica L. growing in his garden at Upton at the time of his death in 1780. And in 1790, John Mackie of Norwich listed R. sinica as well as Semperflorens - Ever-flowering Rose and Semperflorens flore incarnato - Flesh-coloured Ever-flowering Rose.

And just for fun, it is worth noting that Lindley claimed that no botanist in Europe had seen the fruit of R. banksiae, even though Boursault had already introduced Banksiae Rosea raised from R. banksiae pollinated by an unspecified red rose.
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Discussion id : 127-619
most recent 16 MAY HIDE POSTS
 
Initial post 16 MAY by Carlos D Neves
So what is the connection to 月月红 yueh yueh hong? Is it a sport?
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Discussion id : 116-347
most recent 17 NOV SHOW ALL
 
Initial post 24 APR 19 by Andrew from Dolton
It says in the profile "no fragrance" but my 'Slater's Crimson China' has quite a strong damask smell.
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Reply #1 of 2 posted 24 APR 19 by HubertG
My 'Semperflorens' has a scent. I wouldn't say it's typical damask, but it has a moderate fragrance.
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Reply #2 of 2 posted 17 NOV by CybeRose
The old records report that the original Crimson China had a scent like the Harebell.

Exotic Botany: Consisting of Coloured Figures, and Scientific Descriptions, t. 91, 1806
Sir James Edward Smith
ROSA semperflorens.
The double flowers have a faint sweet smell, at least in a warm room, resembling that of the Harebell.

The Cyclopaedia; Or, Universal Dictionary of Arts, Sciences and Literature, Volume 31, page 14 (1819)
13. Scilla nutans; Hare-bell Squill or Wild Hyacinth ... "The flowers have a light sweet scent, more perceptible than in the preceding [S. campanulata], and resembling that of the Dark China Rose, Rosa semperflorens."

Joseph Knight raised a flock of seedlings from the original, that differed somewhat in color and form. He also raised a variety called 'Animating', presumably from a cross of the Crimson China and the Blush Tea-scented. The fragrance of this one was so distinctive that Viibert (1826) named a rose 'Noisette odeur de Bengale animating/'.

"Damask" is not a scent that would be associated with a China rose.
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