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"Kampong rose Reviews & Comments
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"Thornless, or almost" ???? The sample picture that came up clearly showed numerous giant hooked thorns.
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If you can tell us whose picture it was, perhaps those who grow and know “Maggie” can comment. However, as this rose grows in many different climates over the world, it may produce more thorns in a different locality. The 2006, p30 reference is valuable reading.
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A 'common rose' here in my climate (Tropical Monsoon). It has hooked thorns that might stop you in your tracks. Although not as sinister as Multiflora (multiflora var carnea) thorns.
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Does anyone know what the name mean?
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"Dancing lavender swallow wings or something like that I think?
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#2 of 3 posted
1 MAR 16 by
alex.m.
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Thank you very much :-)!
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The purple swallow dancing.
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This looks a lot like Maggie
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Thanks Armand. I've Noted that in the 'Zi Yan Fei Wu' file - and it is also Noted in the "Maggie" (syn. Eugène E. Marlitt) file.
It would be valuable to find out how old this "very old Chinese cultivar" actually is - or when it was first referenced in China.
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Hello, its chinese name is 紫燕飞舞, if you google it you will see lots of pics and info (you may need google translate!) There are also a couple of websites from china and japan that indicate that this is Eugene Marlitt aka Maggie, and ive grown Maggie for decades and seen its growth habit in europe, asia and the usa, and I can say its a splitting image.
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Thanks Armand. I have added that chinese synonym.
You are the second person to say 'Zi Yan Fei (or Fe) Wu' is the same as "Maggie".
John Hook also noted that in his comment (below) that his plant of 'Zi Yan Fei Wu' appeared to be the same as "Kakinada Red".
It would appear that 'Zi Yan Fei Wu' should carry the double quotes of a "foundling", and merged with 'Eugène E. Marlitt'. But I am really cautious with this one and would love to have more input from rosarians - and perhaps that earliest date for Zi Yan Fei Wu.
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#4 of 14 posted
15 SEP 18 by
HubertG
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This also makes you wonder more about other "old" Chinese roses such as 'Tipsy Imperial Concubine'.
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Well, in Dr Wang Guoliang's book Old Roses in China, this rose is reported to be called Bao Xiang (Precious Portrait) by the Chinese, and Dancing Purple Swallows by the Japanese (the ancient japanese used chinese characters), and a rose by this name has been recorded since the Song Dynasty (960–1279AD), And he surmises that they are all the same, including Maggie, Pacific, Kakinada Red, Eugene Marlitt. Although I must say that the Kakinada Red I saw in India didn't look similar...
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For Armand_212 - and others.
Forgive my slowness Armand. It is spring and the sun is shining after months of grizzle drizzle - I should be "out there" so I am not concentrating too well. But as "Maggie" is a really important rose I am not going to do anything without the input from others.
It seems that we should:
Give 'Zi Yan Fei Wu' the double quotes of a foundling.
Change the name of "Maggie" (syn. Eugène E. Marlitt) - to just "Maggie"
Change the name of "Pacific" (syn. Eugène E. Marlitt) - to just "Pacific".
Merge "Zi yan Fei Wu" with "Maggie".
Make a new file for 'Madame Eugène E. Marlitt' (syns 'Eugène E. Marlitt' and 'Eugénie John Marlitt')
Transfer all relevant references for...Marlitt....out of "Maggie" and into the new 'Madame Eugenie E. Marlitt' file.
Transfer all photos entered under the name of ....Marlitt... out of "Maggie" and into 'Madame Eugenie E. Marlitt'.
(There are about 23 or so photos that were added under the name of ....Marlitt. Are any of these ....Marlitt, or are they all "Maggie".)
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In the absence of "other's" direction, I am tackling this rose as best I can.
What are the correct spellings please.
Zi Yan Fei Wu
Zi Yan Fe Wu
Bao Xiang
Baoxiang
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HI
The correct forms are "Zi Yan Fei Wu" and "Bao Xiang"
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Thank you. I've merged the files. Please take a look. At this stage, 'Zi Yan Fei Wu' carries the single quotes and "Bao Xiang" carries the double quotes of a foundling.
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Hi, Eugene Marlitt is commonly used as a synonym for this rose and many people believe that it is the same rose as which is commonly known as Maggie and Bao Xiang etc. should there be a mention of that on the maggie page?
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There is Armand. See the last line of the Notes.
Probably the line in the 2011 reference: "Hungarian rose breeder Rudolf Geschwind first introduced it as 'Julius Fabianics de Misefa', but it was later distributed as 'Eugen E. Marlitt'. " needs to be explored further, but I do not have the resources to do that.
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Armand, I have been reading Gregg Lowery's excellent article in the 2006 Rosa Mundi and adding bits and pieces from it to the references. It is an absolutely fascinating article, made even more fascinating for me by my long-held thoughts that my Australian foundling "Wilson Street Nannup" may be the same as "Maggie". I will certainly get a sucker of my rose and get it out into a full sun area to see if it repeats then. Thank you for your help, patience and advice.
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We have "Zi Yan Fei Wu", "Kakinada red" and Julius Fabianacs. All have been growing in our garden for several years now. IMO "Zi Yan Fei Wu" and "Kakinada red" are the same but not the same as Julius Fab which among other things is consistantly more prickly. Although "Kakinada red" is Indian it is thought to have originated from China.
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Hello John,
I would suggest chasing back the provenance of your prickly ‘Julius Fabianics de Misefa‘ as far as you can go.
And talk to the nursery Rosenschule Martin Weingart. This from the references:
2006. Rosa Mundi p32. Gregg Lowery. Maggie – a Rose Mystery.
This all seemed to be resolving nicely but for one thing: nurseryman Martin Weingart had uncovered a rare Geschwind hybrid called ‘Julius Fabianics de Misefa’, introduced in 1902, that proved to be identical to “Maggie” as well!.
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This was mentioned in comments, but not actually added as a reference. The interesting bit is that this rose could not have been raised by Geschwind -- though it is possible he obtained it and introduced it himself. Like 'Rose Edouard', this rose has been going around for centuries under several names.
https://fshs.org/proceedings-o/2013-vol-126/FSHS_Vol_126/273-275.pdf
:-)
~Christopher
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Thank you Christopher. I have added the link as the 2013 reference. Also added a Note on the main page.
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