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'Champagnerröschen' rose Reviews & Comments
Discussion id : 120-670
most recent 5 days ago HIDE POSTS
 
Initial post 6 days ago by Darrell
According to A. Hardy's Catalogue des Rosiers cultives au Jardin du Luxembourg of 1837, 'de Meaux' is ascribed to Desfontaines (Rene-Louiche Desfontaines (1750-1833), a French botanist who became chair of the Royal Garden des Plantes in 1786). If Hardy is correct, then the date assigned here on HMF is incorrect. And we know the source of the rose.
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Reply #1 of 4 posted 5 days ago by Patricia Routley
If Desfontaines (Rene-Louiche Desfontaines (1750-1833) was born in 1750, he must have been a child prodigy. . Our first two references are from 1755 and 1764.
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Reply #2 of 4 posted 5 days ago by Darrell
Which is why I began my sentence with "If Hardy is correct." But apparently he wasn't. He doesn't state that Desfontaines was the originator of the rose. He merely abbreviates his name after listing the rose. Perhaps he meant Desfontaines introduced it to France from, say, the low countries. Perhaps he was wrong. Perhaps he got the dates wrong. I've always maintained that just because we find a statement in print, whether of a few hundred years ago or now, doesn't mean the information is correct. Back to the archives.
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Reply #3 of 4 posted 5 days ago by jedmar
Hardy's "attributions" do not per se mean breeder or introducer. He refers offers to the Botanical work where the rose is mentioned, as e.g. Nouveau Duhamel, or Thory, or Pronville; or he lists provenances. One can see the latter clearly when he groups rose names as synonyms, e.g.
Duc d'Angoulême, Vibert
Reine d'Espagne, Dubourg Douai
Impératrice Marie Thérèse, Bruxelles
Grande Duchesse, idem
Grandesse Royale, Enghien
Pucelle de Waubrosken, Saudeur
Beau présent, Madame Faber

This was all the same rose for Hardy and he seems to have received it under the different names from these various nurseries. It does not mean that any one of them was the breeder.
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Reply #4 of 4 posted 5 days ago by Darrell
Ah! Thank you for the clarification, Behcet.
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Discussion id : 80-796
most recent 30 SEP 14 HIDE POSTS
 
Initial post 30 SEP 14 by Unregistered Guest
Available from - David Austin
https://www.davidaustinroses.com
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Discussion id : 65-827
most recent 17 JUL 12 HIDE POSTS
 
Initial post 17 JUL 12 by Cradoc
Simply the most black-spotty thing I've ever grown. It looked like someone had tipped a bottle of Indian Ink over the plant. Although I sprayed regularly, it succumbed in very short order. A pity as the flowers were quite sweet although the scent was rather slight. Perhaps it does better in climates other than cool temperate?
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Reply #1 of 1 posted 17 JUL 12 by HMF Admin
Thanks for taking the time to share your experience - this is VERY helpful and just what HMF is all about.
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Discussion id : 49-626
most recent 13 NOV 10 HIDE POSTS
 
Initial post 13 NOV 10 by RosenNette
Available from - Karl Otto Schütt
www.historische-rosen-schuett.de
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