'Mrs. Oliver Ames' rose reviews and comments

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'Mrs. Oliver Ames' rose Reviews & Comments

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Discussion id : 167-818 most recent 11 JUL HIDE POSTS

Initial post 11 JUL by odinthor

"Not yet disseminated” in 1901 (American Florist, vol. 16, 1901, p. 1276); being catalogued and distributed by John N. May in 1902. The 1898 attached to this variety appears to signify when the sport originally occurred for Montgomery. It was registered with the Society of American Florists by Robert Montgomery on December 4, 1899.	REPLY

Discussion id : 93-909 most recent 8 JUL 16 HIDE POSTS

Initial post 6 JUL 16 by HMF supporting member

scvirginia

The 1903 article from the Journal of the Royal Horticultural Society states that 'Mrs. Oliver Ames' is a sport from 'Mrs. Pierpont Morgan' discovered by Montgomery and introduced by May. I think these separate records for 'Mrs. Oliver Ames' ought to be merged, with Montgomery listed as discoverer, May as introducer, and 'Mrs. Pierpont Morgan' as the parent.

The earliest mention I find is 1900, so I wonder where the 1898 date comes from...?

Virginia

Reply #1 of 2 posted 8 JUL 16 by HMF supporting member

Patricia Routley

You are probably right Virginia. I have had a search for information but didn't find much, apart from the 1898 date, mentioned in the 1922 American Rose Annual reference. I briefly looked at the colour of each rose, and the Montgomery sport seemed a little paler than the May sport. but nothing was clear-cut. If you are happy with merging, then I would say go ahead. Patricia	REPLY

Reply #2 of 2 posted 8 JUL 16 by HMF supporting member

scvirginia

I have eyed this pair of records before, and thought that it unlikely that there were two separate roses of the same name, having the same description (and pretty much the same parentage since 'Mrs Pierpont' was a sport of 'Mme Cusin'), and introduced about the same time. If there were two different roses, it seems peculiar that none of the references said so. The RHS reference just confirmed what I already suspected.

Thanks for looking into it, and adding the extra references.
Virginia

PS I have merged the records, and kept the discovery date as 1898. It makes sense that one would test a sport for at least a year or two to see if it is fixed, before introducing it to commerce.

Discussion id : 20-675 most recent 1 AUG 07 HIDE POSTS

Initial post 1 AUG 07 by altora

Per Brent C. Dickerson's "Roll-Call: The Old Rose Breeder" 'Mrs. Oliver Ames' Breeder: Robert Montgomery, Natick, MA USA, T 1898	REPLY

Reply #1 of 1 posted 1 AUG 07 by HMF supporting member

Cass

Thanks for that!	REPLY