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HubertG 
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If the photo in the 1957-58 Kordes catalogue is any indication it looks like the other photos here of 'Dorothy Goodwin' show a reversion to 'Peace'.
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Is this rose still being sold in Australia? Does it still grow in any Australian garden?
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#2 of 2 posted
6 days ago by
HubertG
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I don't know but I'd say not. I just came across the old photograph randomly looking for something else and thought it was interesting enough to post.
I note that it wasn't in Kordes' catalogue of 1962 (if I recall correctly) so it seems like it might have been an unstable sport.
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This is listed as "Archduke Joseph" (with no description) in the Mount Barker Courier of 11 April, 1902, page 3, in an article describing the Aldgate Nursery of Messrs. Smith and Menzel in South Australia.
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I am sure Archduke was a pretty common mis-spelling in Australia. I know ‘Archiduc Charles’ copped it as well for decades.
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I've come across a wonderful example of how names blur. Peach Melba, as a favourite of US sailors eating out at a Barcelona restaurant, became pijama (pyjamas) among the Catalan kitchen staff, and variants of the dish were for a while part of Catalan cuisine. (Wiki).
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#3 of 5 posted
2 MAY 20 by
HubertG
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Sorry, my point was not really that there was an obvious synonym but that this rose was available at a South Australian nursery rather early on. (Note to self - best not to post at 3am in bed lol).
The Aldgate nursery was also the only nursery in Australia found in old archives so far to have sold 'Albert Stopford', so, as they seemed to have imported a lot of varieties, I do wonder if any foundlings in that region might be rather rare or obscure cultivars.
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Have just come across this posting. Yes, we have found some rarities in the area. Eg what we think is Geschwind's Orden in the next little town, Mylor. And a nice HP, "Mylor Primary", one of the many pink-and-silvers. And the ubiquitous (in southern Australia and NZ) "Hugh Childs".
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#5 of 5 posted
9 days ago by
HubertG
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If I recall correctly, that Aldgate nursey was quite a large affair, so the chances of any foundling from Mylor having been purchased at that nursery are extremely high in my opinion. A nursery list or two from that time would be handy to narrow down the Mylor foundling possibilities.
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Initial post
10 days ago by
HubertG
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Very Interesting. The names I can read with certainly are A. Rivoire, Gigantea, Fragrant Pillar, John Cronin, Mrs F Guthrie, City of L. Rock, McGredy's Sunset, Pink Dawn, S de G Prat and G. Nabonnand. I might be able to make out some more with time.
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#1 of 4 posted
10 days ago by
Nastarana
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Would 'Pink Dawn' be the Howard & Smith introduction from 1949 or another rose of Clark's breeding?
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#2 of 4 posted
10 days ago by
HubertG
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The Howard & Smith 'Pink Dawn' has an introduction date of 1935. The photo is from the 1940 Australian Rose Annual so it looks like Clark was experimenting with a fairly new introduction.
Some of those entries look tantalisingly solvable but still have me stumped.
What I thought was McGredy's Sunset might be McGredy's Scarlet - it's hard to tell.
I think there's a Chatenay as well.
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I had a go too and came up with
6531
6532 Antoine Rivoire (1895)
6533. 2229 x ?Duchesse d'Auerstadt [Billy’s suggestion]
6534 39_5 x ?Duchesse d'Auerstadt
6535 Elegante (1882 or 1918)
6536 Fragrant Pillar (1931) x d___
6537 John Cronin (1935)
6531b John Cronin
6532b Antoine Rivoire (1895) x
6533b Mrs Frank Guthrie (1923).
6534b Mrs Frank Guthrie (1923) x
6535b vs from veg gdn
6536b good red veg gdn [HubertG’s comment below]
6537b Walter ....... ?Bentley?
6545 City of Little Rock (1924)
6551 McGredy's Scarlet (1928)
6552 Mme Abel Chatenay (1894)
6553 Mrs Edouard Powell (1910)
6554 Bohm's Triumph (1934)
6555
6561 striped sport…. [HubertG’s comment below]
6562 3675 sported…..[HubertG’s comment below]
6565 Crusader? (1919) [HubertG’s comment below]
6569 Souvenir de Gustave Prat (1910)
6573 G. Nabonnand (1888)
6574 Stella. (1905)
But this was only one page, probably between 1935 (John Cronin) and 1940. Just look at all the pages under the left hand.
The numbering is of mild interest. Look at how he went back to insert some b’s.
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#4 of 4 posted
9 days ago by
HubertG
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Patricia, I believe 6565 is Crusader.
6561 might say "striped sport" etc, and 6562 might be "3675 sported" but I'm not certain.
Vegetable garden looks right (that had me stumped because I was thinking of a name) but I think it says "good red veg gdn".
The entries where he has put something which you thought might be 'Duchesse d'Auerstadt' I notice are the numbers he has repeated a little further down the list and I think it is more likely to be some sort of abbreviated annotation to indicate such an additional entry, but I can't discern exactly what.
I believe you are right with 'Stella'. It's interesting that was the parent of one of his very first roses 'Ruby Ring' and that he was still using it decades later.
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I am wondering if anyone recognizes this beautiful, lightly fragranced rose grown from a cutting taken from a 1920's house in Melbourne, Australia? It has smooth pedicels, dull, narrow leaves and has few thorns.
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If you re-open your post you'll find it has grown an Add Photos button.
Does the plant repeat-flower? Does it set hips? Does it sucker when grown from a cutting? Is it a bush or a climber?
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#2 of 5 posted
12 days ago by
Rebedina
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Apologies for the late uploading of photos. The plant in question is a bush and does not sucker. It has round hips and does repeat flower.
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#3 of 5 posted
12 days ago by
HubertG
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For some reason it made me think of Dickson's 'Dean Hole' of 1904, but I don't know how likely it would be for that to have survived.
Rebedina, when you say a cutting taken from a 1920s house, do you have good reason to think it might be of the same era of the house? It could be something from much later.
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#5 of 5 posted
12 days ago by
Rebedina
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It certainly could be a much later rose, you're right.
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