HelpMeFind Roses, Clematis and Peonies
Roses, Clematis and Peonies
and everything gardening related.
Blue Zinnia
most recent 5 MAY SHOW ALL
Initial post 14 OCT 12 by goncmg
If someone who has never EVER grown roses was to come to me and ask what should they try my answer would be TIFFANY. It, unlike Queen Elizabeth which is also so easy to grow, it LOOKS like what people WANT a rose to look like: big bloom generally on a single stem, fragrant, warm pink lit gold....indestructable....hardy.............for the more saged growers I think it doesn't really "stand out" is one of those reliable "work horses" definately worth a place in the line-up but almost BECAUSE it lacks any sort of notable faults or ticks and is basically PINK it sort of gets a little forgotten about but really should be more lauded by us old rose souls..........60 years old and it is available own root, budded, mail order, upscale garden center, grocery store, probably in a fast food drive thru as well (!).........and always has been...............and always should IS what people THINK of when they think ROSE..........surprisingly it has been a parent to more notable varieties than one would think, too....some pass on the good more than others and Tiffany is one of those....I am a grower who slightly favors the abstreuse and forgets to pay attention to/love the more obvious who perform so well, are so strong, and who were introduced mid-century (my specialty/interest) and are just so SOLID.........this is a GREAT rose...........

For those who are "saged": compare Tiffany to Helen Traubel!!!! Both were AARS early 50's but 60 years ahead there is just no comparison. There wasn't 10 years later in my opinion. Traubel was still highly rated into the 70's but weak necks, no scent, can ball, color is a little mutable, and the plant just sprawls and sprawls messily.............when I think Tiffany seems "bland" I remind myself to look beyond the color and look at the plant, smell the bloom, and so on.............
Reply #1 of 7 posted 14 JAN 13 by Dianne's Southwest Idaho Rose Garden
I truly appreciate your comment, and completely agree. You led me to realize that I haven't paid due attention to my Tiffany, for just the reasons you gave. Now I can hardly wait for May/June so I can see what I've been missing!
Reply #2 of 7 posted 2 FEB 14 by Blue Zinnia
Bravo! (or brava, as the case may be.) This is a great case in point for those of us, mostly older folks, who believe that no rose is ever "superseded" or "replaced" by something more modern. This is a great rose, regardless of anything that came before or after; it's simply itself, and very beautiful (ladies, try one of the vase-shaped buds on the lapel of a pale yellow or green summer jacket!!) The fragrance is also something special, and it carries like crazy. Add easy cultivation to that, and you've got a winner, in this or any other decade.
Reply #3 of 7 posted 6 APR 14 by Matt's Northwest Florida Garden
Belinda's Dream, one of the most Blackspot resistant "Large Flowered" roses I grow, came from Tiffany. In the super humid climate of Northwest Florida, this one receives no fungicide spray except one of Lime-Sulfur during the dormant season. Believe me, this is the mecca for Blackspot.
Reply #4 of 7 posted 8 APR by drossb1986
You give a spot-on review. For me, I almost ignore it as much as I ignore it's child, Belinda's Dream. There's just nothing that really bowls you over about it...except maybe for the scent. I think my biggest issue is that it the blooms are just so floppy and don't last long. 3 days and the blooms go from buds to all the petals blown off. I agree, it's an easy grower, but it's just...blah. It's like meeting the perfect significant other and them having the most bland personality. Great on paper, forgettable in reality.
Reply #5 of 7 posted 8 APR by goncmg
LOVE your comment! And I do agree that somehow Tiffany may even be the "perfect" rose on paper...alas, not how it plays out for a lot of us......
Reply #6 of 7 posted 5 MAY by Yankee Doodle Stevie
It sounds like we have rather similar tastes in some regards. I too consider the middle of the 20th century to be the golden age of roses. The vast majority of varieties we have grown have been released from that general era (cheating a bit on either side occasionally.)

Tiffany is indeed an all-time and modern classic. As you say, it is everything one could want in a rose. Where we are, weather can sometimes vary from the 40's one night to 90 degree highs just a day or two later. But ole gal Tiffany just keeps chugging along, looking and smelling great. There is something quite charming about it's silvery pink with gold heart flower. No disease to speak of. Cuts well. My Mom's all-time favorite, I would never be without her.
Reply #7 of 7 posted 5 MAY by Jay-Jay
One ought to try to obtain the climbing version. You could cut long-stemmed roses for the vase too from her.
most recent 28 DEC SHOW ALL
Initial post 15 APR 11 by k~T~h o'Silicon Valley
APL 2011 ~ White Licorice is on sale for $35.00 at SummerWinds Nursery(formally Woolworth Garden Centers) in Silicon Valley,CA stores.
Reply #1 of 19 posted 13 MAR 16 by Blue Zinnia
Grossly overpriced. Edmunds has it for around $18 and Witherspoon for around $23, and even with shipping it works out cheaper. Edmunds' plants are good, but Witherspoon's are enough better to warrant the additional $5; in fact, they're the best I've ever seen, from a mail-order place or any other seller.
Reply #2 of 19 posted 2 MAY 17 by StrawChicago Alkaline clay 5a
I saw many bare-root-body-bag & grafted-on Dr.Huey White Licorice on sale at Menards this spring for less than $5.
Reply #3 of 19 posted 3 MAY 17 by Blue Zinnia
That's great, and I'll go look. We're having trouble here with rose rosette disease, though, and those bagged discount-store roses need very thorough looking-over. If even one in the store is showing symptoms, don't buy there, and wash your hands, clothes and shoes in hot water before going near your own roses again. Dry on "hot", too, to make sure any mites are dead. RRD is _devastating._ It'll kill your own roses, and can go on to those of your neighbors for a couple blocks around. It is not curable or even treatable. And then unless the soil is completely dug out and replaced, you and they will have to wait years to grow roses again.
Another of the bad vectors for the disease is the "Knockout" roses--yet another reason not to grow the damn things. :)
Reply #4 of 19 posted 3 MAY 17 by StrawChicago Alkaline clay 5a
If I see another Knock-out I'm going to puke. It's everywhere in the neighborhood. Walmart's parking lot had a bunch of them .. so glad they died over the winter.
Reply #5 of 19 posted 5 MAY 17 by Puns 'n' Roses
This is an earnest question, not meant as a provocation: What is it with Knock Out that makes people react so strongly and negatively ? I' ve read rose people a couple of times saying they hate it. I have never seen Knock Out knowingly - I've seen one rose of which I thought it might be Knock Out which was most impressive - so I'm not able to form my own opinion (yet). Many people seem to love it (obviously it's planted in lots of places), yet many don't. Why?
Reply #6 of 19 posted 5 MAY 17 by StrawChicago Alkaline clay 5a
The older RED single-petal knock-out is extremely thorny, ugly bush. The newer RED double-petal knock-out is more slender & compact. The PINK double-Knock-out doesn't have much thorns, but not as vigorous as the RED version. My neighbor was really mad when her PINK knock-out sprouted bright cherry-RED, it was actually grafted on a RED knock-out. It was not Dr.Huey, but actually a RED-knock-out as rootstock. She offered to me for FREE, but I already killed a bunch of my RED knock-outs.
Reply #7 of 19 posted 5 MAY 17 by Jay-Jay
Not all the rose-lovers detest prickles on a rose.
Knock Out roses have more to offer than being prickly.
As for continuous flowering, as for climate zonage and possibly as for breeding material for future Earth-kind roses.
Reply #8 of 19 posted 6 MAY 17 by StrawChicago Alkaline clay 5a
I have been growing these landscape roses for 17 years: 6 Knock-outs and 3 Flower Carpet roses. Knock-outs (both pink and red) need a HUGE amount of water to bloom, but break out in cerespora with acidic rain. Flower Carpet is way better than Knock-out. Flower Carpet blooms 1 month ahead of Knock-out in spring. Flower Carpet is drought-tolerant & better zone 5a winter survival & can handle spring flood. I never see any diseases in Flower Carpet's glossy foliage & way more blooms than Knock-outs.

Flower Carpets need less water to bloom than Knock-outs. Both rose parks (Cantigny with 1,200 roses) and Chicago Botanical garden (5,000 roses) got rid of their red-single-Knock-out: ugly bush shape. These parks still grow double-pink Knock-out (better bush shape & more flowers). Home Run is even stingier than Knock-out in blooms. Cantigny rose park got rid of Home run, only 1/10 the amount of blooms compared to Flower Carpet. For pictures of Flower Carpet at Chicago Botanical Garden, see the below link, which I took last spring:
Reply #9 of 19 posted 6 MAY 17 by Andrew from Dolton
Maybe they grow better in Europe?
BTW Straw, loved Chicago Botanic gardens, great pictures.
Reply #14 of 19 posted 9 MAY 17 by Fadi
I love my flower carpet yellow !
Absolutely beautiful!
No watering
No fertiliser
No disease
Flood tolerant ! Leafing out while practically setting
In water after spring snow melt and flood

Tolerant of heavy wet clay in Canada z5

Highly recommend
I also recommend the drift roses
Reply #15 of 19 posted 9 MAY 17 by StrawChicago Alkaline clay 5a
You mean "flower carpet amber"? Saw that at Lowe's for $10 in late fall (1/2 price), and the leaves were so pretty & glossy & perfect. The blooms were peachy yellow. Too bad I didn't buy it.
Reply #16 of 19 posted 9 MAY 17 by Fadi
I have the flower carpet yellow , red , scarlet, and pink supreme
I meant the flower carpet yellow , I planted 3 yellow together in a shady
area ( 3 hours of sun ) , the area is flooded in spring and wet during the summer
so no watering at all. The yellow grows tall and not bushy like the red or scarlet
I planted the pink supreme in fall last tea so it was dormant and I am looking to flower this year
I posted a picture of my flower carpet yellow on helpmefind

The leaves are very glossy and no disease at all in shade ; of course I would expect it to flower more in full sun
But I am really happy with the performance of yellow

I haven't seen the Amber but I would buy this if I still have a space
I have 2 drifts and I want to buy the apricot drift: very compact and hardy
Reply #17 of 19 posted 10 MAY 17 by StrawChicago Alkaline clay 5a
I saw your link ... so pretty !!
Reply #10 of 19 posted 6 MAY 17 by Nastarana
What it is about 'Knockout' is that it is, for many of us, a bland, boring rose with a dull color. In addition, the hype surrounding this rose was beyond annoying. What KO offers, an easy care, long blooming splash of color, has been in fact available for many years. Chinas and teas for the warmer zones, polyanthas and some of the floribundas for temperate gardens, and rugosas and some of the Canadian roses offer the same thing with much more attractive flowers.

Furthermore, what might be called landscape roses have also been available from at least around the mid-80s. The Flowercarpets from Noack (I think), the Meidillands and Drifts from Meilland and the low growing, bright roses from Ping Lim and Bear Creek all offer a better, IMHO, version of what you get from the KOs. I grow both 'White Meidilland' and 'Alba Meidilland'; both are perfectly cane hardy in zone 5, have far more beautiful flowers than, e.g.. 'White Out'. I consider 'Alba Meidilland', an ever blooming rambler, to be in fact a great rose, to be ranked with such classics as 'Peace' and 'Mr. Lincoln'.

Having said all that, what I am excited about from Mr. Radler is the larger bushes, like 'Milwaukee Calatrava' and climbers he is working on now.
Reply #11 of 19 posted 7 MAY 17 by StrawChicago Alkaline clay 5a
Very well written, Nastarana. THANK YOU. There's the myth of "blackspot-resistant-strain" which made Knock-out famous. Drift roses can do what Knock-out cannot do: stay healthy in flood zone. My neighbor's Drift roses get bigger as they get older, while her 30+ Knock-out shrank due to poor winter-survival.

Val who works for decades at a landscape company in warm Florida, zone 8b, gave THUMB-DOWN for Knock-out, for the same reason: cerespora fungal-disease from rain, plus not blooming well in hot & dry spell.

Chicago botanical garden has a large tree, which they planted dozens of light pink & double Flower Carpet in a circle next to the tree. There were more blooms than leaves on those roses, despite being planted ON TOP of tree's root & partial shade. Flower Carpet can easily get the "more blooms than leaves" look, but Knock-out cannot, unless it's week-long rain. See below link pictures of Drift roses, Flower Carpet, and Ping-Lim roses at Cantigny Rose Park, which I took near my alkaline clay, zone 5a. Rainbow Knock-out was the worst-looking among their 1,000+ landscape bushes:
Reply #12 of 19 posted 8 MAY 17 by Blue Zinnia
Also, KO (1.) is ugly between flushes, (2.) has virtually no fragrance, (3.) sets no fruit, and (4.) has squeezed most or all other roses out of a lot of garden centers. Personally, I don't find the color dull, and I do like the look of an established KO in full bloom. But there are just too many good reasons to hate them...not least that the landlady's KO's rose rosette disease (for which KOs are an absolute magnet) took out my best-ever, really glorious plant of my alltime favorite hybrid tea, Kordes Perfecta, and made it impossible for us to grow roses here for years on.
Reply #18 of 19 posted 21 MAY 17 by StrawChicago Alkaline clay 5a
The use of chemical fertilizer high in nitrogen do attract pests (including RRD mites). There are many studies that show high nitrogen attract pests. When the natural environment is altered with chemicals, that invite pathogenic pests. When a rose is weakened with acidity (either from acidic soil, or acidic rain, or acidic fertilziers), pests can take over. If you google "pH of rain across USA, you'll see a pH of 4.5 for my Chicagoland, and even lower for the east coast.

Re-post the info. I gave: "HMF is the best source for info., but I wish folks would specify their soil & climate & planting zone & what region of the country. People want to hold on to "old generalizations", rather than learning. Like nearby rose park, I was shocked to see them dumping sulfur in spring ... they burnt Tamora (prefers alkaline), also induced RRD (rose rosette disease) on Pink Traviata (Meilland rose) which also prefers alkaline. Gypsum is also acidic, I killed lots of earthworms using that stuff, and it burns my finger. Gypsum has calcium plus sulfur.

I made the same mistake years ago: dumping sulfur plus high nitrogen chemical fertilizer on a Grandma' Blessing rose, changing my soil pH to very acidic. It immediately came down with RRD five years ago. That's the ONLY rose with RRD in my 30+ years of growing roses, among 100+ varieties. I planted Radio Times in the exact spot, but I raised the pH with more alkaline clay, and no RRD ever since. I wish folks would stop generalizations, "Mr. Lincoln for fragrant reds", "roses prefer acidic", and "roses need full-sun". Own-root roses are completely different from each other.
Reply #19 of 19 posted 28 DEC by Blue Zinnia
Hmmm....our rain here is mildly acidic, but not enough to wreck the soil pH, which I checked. And nothing got dumped on my Kordes Perfecta but good old Black Cow; the landlady's KO didn't even get that. RRD is spread by a mite, and if significant numbers of the mites are around, the roses in the area are likely to get it, despite decent pH and no chemicals. Sucks, but there it is.
Reply #13 of 19 posted 8 MAY 17 by Blue Zinnia
Also, there's Bonica, which is beautiful, tough, floriferous over a very long season, reasonably fragrant, and genuinely healthy, and which sets good hips, Royal Bonica is also excellent.

And then there are the Griffith Buck roses, many of which are shrubby (see Carefree Beauty, among others) and nearly all of which are tough, lovely, floriferous, hardy, and healthy. Most are at least somewhat fragrant.
most recent 3 MAY 17 HIDE POSTS
Initial post 3 MAY 17 by Blue Zinnia
A really nice shot. You've captured the color exactly, which isn't easy to do.
Reply #1 of 1 posted 3 MAY 17 by Seil
Thanks. I agree, reds are the hardest to get right.
most recent 3 MAY 17 HIDE POSTS
Initial post 3 MAY 17 by Blue Zinnia
Stunning! A really poetic photo. This is one I wish I could download. <smile>
Reply #1 of 1 posted 3 MAY 17 by Seil
Thank you so much!
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