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'Dinky' rose Reviews & Comments
Discussion id : 119-853
most recent 19 JAN 20 HIDE POSTS
 
Initial post 19 JAN 20 by NewDawn
Available from - burlington
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Discussion id : 106-582
most recent 27 NOV 17 SHOW ALL
 
Initial post 20 NOV 17 by Andrew from Dolton
This rose looks far more multiflora than hybrid musk.
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Reply #1 of 24 posted 21 NOV 17 by Jay-Jay
Most/a lot of Musk hybrids do!
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Reply #2 of 24 posted 21 NOV 17 by jedmar
Pemberton named them Hybrid Musks although they were descendants of 'Trier', a hybrid multiflora. 'Trier' itself has some Noisette in it, but is more Multiflora. The convention kept the term Hybrid Musk although it is misleading.
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Reply #3 of 24 posted 21 NOV 17 by Andrew from Dolton
It grows like a giant version of some of my R. multiflora 'Minima' seedlings. I can't see any of R. moschata in it at all.
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Reply #4 of 24 posted 21 NOV 17 by Jay-Jay
If You would like to have a Moschata hybrid, just buy Musquée sans Soucis!
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Reply #5 of 24 posted 21 NOV 17 by Andrew from Dolton
I don't need to, a kind man from The Netherlands gave me some seedlings.
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Reply #6 of 24 posted 21 NOV 17 by Jay-Jay
Ooooooooooooooops...
And how do they look and behave? Like a Moschata?
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Reply #7 of 24 posted 21 NOV 17 by Andrew from Dolton
They have thinner stems than I would be expecting from a hybrid musk, but I am really only familiar with 'Felicia', 'Buff Beauty', 'Penelope', 'Cornelia', 'Wilhelm' and 'Prosperity', I suppose out of all of them they would be most like 'Prosperity'. I will have to wait until next year and see what the flowers are like.
Going back to 'Dinky,' it has almost no scent, I think a true hybrid musk should at least have some musk fragrance.
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Reply #8 of 24 posted 21 NOV 17 by Jay-Jay
As Jedmar said... it is a Multiflora Hybrid (of Rosa multiflora Thunb. ), like most of the so-called hybrid Musks are (like Mr. Lens bred). And like Felicia, and I have a hunch, that the others You mentioned have no or almost no Musk blood too, but a Multiflora ancestry.
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Reply #9 of 24 posted 22 NOV 17 by Andrew from Dolton
I never realised quite how tenuous the musk connection was.
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Reply #10 of 24 posted 22 NOV 17 by Jay-Jay
When You look at Penelope, way back in the parentage tree, behind Desprez, You can actually find Rosa moschata Herrm. But what the unknown parentage is of the other used roses and/or seedlings???
There is a most interesting book about hybrid Musks written by Anne Velle with a Geneology tree of Hybrid- Moschata in it: ISBN: 978 90 209 9623 4
Maybe Anne Velle might be able/willing/so kind to upload that page... or the interested might buy this book!
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Reply #11 of 24 posted 22 NOV 17 by Andrew from Dolton
Thank you for that Jay-Jay.
'Penelope' is one of my favourite roses, the bud clusters as the first blooms are just opening look quite moschata like. Apparently it is the only rose with pink hips, but I have never seen photographic evidence of this. Mine only ever manage a dullish orange.
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Reply #13 of 24 posted 22 NOV 17 by Jay-Jay
Orange hips You mean and pink flower-buds?
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Reply #12 of 24 posted 22 NOV 17 by Jay-Jay
I selected the best seedlings, potted them and later re-potted them twice in bigger and bigger pots whilst fertilizing them twice this season.
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Reply #14 of 24 posted 22 NOV 17 by Andrew from Dolton
Graham Stuart Thomas says that 'Penenope' has pink hips.
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Reply #15 of 24 posted 22 NOV 17 by Jay-Jay
A slip of the tongue?
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Reply #16 of 24 posted 22 NOV 17 by Andrew from Dolton
Thomas wrote hips as heps, because of the reference to that part of a females' anatomy. He used the archaic English spelling shew/shews instead of show/shows.
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Reply #17 of 24 posted 22 NOV 17 by Jay-Jay
No confusion over here, we call them "bottels" (not Bottles). But some hips look like bottles or are urn-shaped.
Never thought of that female anatomy in combination with the rose-fruits. Freud would have liked the use of language by Graham Stuart Thomas or his hesitation to use the word hip ;-)
And is the color rose/rosé (roze in Dutch) not in fact pink? Rose-hips wrongly transformed in pink hips?
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Reply #18 of 24 posted 22 NOV 17 by Andrew from Dolton
It is from the same school of Victorian Englishness that once covered up piano and table legs in case they caused any erotic thoughts.
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Reply #19 of 24 posted 22 NOV 17 by Jay-Jay
chuckle chuckle.
PS: I once formed/made an ax-handle, to have more grip, like a ladies-calf. No Victorian Duch-ness for me.
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Reply #20 of 24 posted 22 NOV 17 by Andrew from Dolton
It's like the French say 'Cuisse de Nymphe' and the English 'Maiden's Blush'.
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Reply #21 of 24 posted 27 NOV 17 by Jay-Jay
Is any rose known to develop pink hips?
I never saw any and never heard of that.
Heard of, or seen these colors: Red, orange, yellow, green, all in different shades... and black hips.
Brown and gray hips too, but they were rotten or mouldy.
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Reply #22 of 24 posted 27 NOV 17 by Andrew from Dolton
In Graham Stuart Thomas Shrub Roses of Today, 1974 revised edition p.162-3:

'Penelope'.
...By late November the heps develop their soft colouring, it is a delightful diversion from the usual red, glossy berries of most shrubs to find these heps are dull and bloom-covered, and change from cool green to coral pink slowly. The warmer the autumn the more highly coloured they become, and last for many weeks. I know of no other shrubs with berries approaching this colour. (Plate III, heps only.).

There is even a coloured plate which I think was painted by Thomas himself, 'Penelope' on the centre left.
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Reply #23 of 24 posted 27 NOV 17 by Jay-Jay
Thank You,
That's indeed pearl pink. Would be nice in fall/winter.
Never seen before. The description on HMF states orange hips.
Maybe a member has some hip-photo's (no röntgen images) and can upload them.
Or make some, for on the Northern Hemisphere it is the time for rose-hips.
Maybe a part of this discussion might be transplanted to the Penelope page?
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Reply #24 of 24 posted 27 NOV 17 by Andrew from Dolton
Jay-Jay, I'll reply to you in the comments for 'Penelope'.
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