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‘Paul Ricault’ or ‘Paul Perras’?
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#1 of 7 posted
4 MAY 19 by
Tessie
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Definitely not Paul Perras which is a compact, pale pink rose, that sets hips. This is a dark pink climbing rose that sets no hips. Very thorny and suckers some. It was sold to me many years ago as Paul Ricault and fits the description of Paul Ricault. I don't understand how a pale pink compact rose can be suggested for the identity of this rose on HMF. The descriptions aren't even close.
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It does look quite like the found rose I identified as 'Paul Ricault' but was later told by a reliable source that it was 'Paul Perras' I didn't know that most of the roses in commerce sold as 'Paul Ricault' are in fact 'Paul Perras' in the U.K. It doesn't sucker but is prickly and lax in growth. I grow it up on wires so it gets a bit more air movement and possibly less blackspot.
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Tessie, I am inclined to agree with you. I am sure I have the same rose as you and I had identified my rose as 'Paul Ricault'. My big, arching. deep pink, spring-only rose sets no hips. I was convinced by the 'Paul Ricault' photo caption, below, to move my photos (and reference) from 'Paul Ricault' to 'Paul Perras'. However, because of the early references to setting hips in 'Paul Perras', I think my roses might be better off in a foundling name file called "Mackereth Cottage -S.A." and "Date Palm Rose - W.A."
I can't really comment on a foundling rose from another country ("The Crepe Rose') but the 2007 reference in 'Paul Perras' indicates that it is the same as the Australian foundlings.
Photo Id: 316130
"Photo taken at The Friends of Vintage Roses, May 2018, Sebastopol, CA. This we believe to be the true Paul Ricault. As all other HMF images appear to be showing Paul Perras, the "Crepe Rose", we wanted to share this. This plant came from Mike Lowe's own-root rose nursery in the 1990s under the name 'Paul Ricault à Fleures Pourpres', a name that does not show up in the literature. He imported this from a European nursery, and we believe that perhaps the prevailing misconception of the time that Paul Perras was actually Paul Ricault may have led the nursery to create that name, as a way of explaining the much deeper, redder color of the rose. This is however the color that is described repeatedly in earlier literature. The plant moreover has the foliage and stance of a Hybrid China/early HP, with a color that at the time was rich and brilliant, showing the Chinensis influence found in others like William Jesse, Malton and Brennus."
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The rose is just starting to bloom, although because it has so many petals it takes ages to open fully. I'll post pictures when it is completely out.
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I think Gregg's point was that the early references describe Paul Ricault as a crimson-red rose (or in one, deep purple).
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Thank you everybody. I am much happier with the ‘Paul Ricault’ identification.
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Would anyone like to comment whether this rose is 'Paul Perras' or 'Paul Ricault'?
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Botanical Journal - Ботанический журнал
Magazine (1979) Page (s) 218 Vol. 64.
V. Тkaczenko rose alabukensis sp. nov. (Sect. LEUCANTHA М. Рор. And Сhrshan.)
Bush to 2.5 m tall, spare branched branches of green, gray-green hornotinis shivers. Аculei Hamas base widened flowing firm base of the leaves on two, rarely three. Leaves odd leaflets (3) 5-9, terminal side submajore, oblong-oval 1.2-4 (4.5) cm long, 0.6-1.7 (2.2) cm wide margin sharp serrated teeth densely short-hairy, hairy briefly above; rhachide densely short hairy aculeolis small solitary protected. Flowers 3.7-4.8 cm in diameter. white, inflorescences corymbosis disposed in the apex of the branches floriferorum. Pedicelli 0.5-1.8 cm long, short, sparse glands. Hypanthium globose, smooth. Sepals entire, densely hairy base margin on short glands solitary buildings after flowering divarieata learn along the grass. Ripe fruit of the orange-red in color.
D. Маjo end-June; fr. August-September. Турus specimen 35 N 180 in dendrario reservation Botanic Garden cad. Sci. RSS Kirghiziae out of the seeds, in his upper jaw, which comes from Tkaczenko, in distresses, 6 fl. Alabuka constant Czatkalensis 30 8 1964 picked up (LE).
Coll: ferganensi break in the narrow d. Arslanbob; 28 8, in the vicinity of the flood gates of a great 1973, 6 Тkaczenko.
Наbitatio, in a region-bushy trees on the banks of the sloping clayey-schistosis more or less humid.
Distribution: High Czatkalense, Uzunachmaticum and ferganensi (tjäna-schan West).
Аffinitas: А form larger ones oblong-oval leaflets near the rose beggerana Schrenk and densely hairy (or ovate, a typical small tip acutatis smooth or hairy briefly below), larger flowers, inflorescence Corymbosa up with different and even ecology.
Alabukensis rose in a closed-region tops of trees fruticosae the issue prolongs fruticeta dense format, blossoms Маio end - the beginning of June; The opening of the specimens seen in the valleys, to the solitary rose of the beggerana Schrenk, however, it is increasing.
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“In his upper jaw”? I am distresses, but I have added it nonetheless. Thanks Robert.
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It’s not a great translation.
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#3 of 5 posted
13 APR 19 by
Tessie
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Rob, can you post the original journal text?
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Other than what is in the Reference section, I've not seen any full text from the citation.
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#4 of 5 posted
13 APR 19 by
 jedmar
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I tried my hand at improving the translation of the second half.
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Disease resistance of this rose is only good?
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A very, very lovely old rose, can get a touch of rust in dry hot weather. Together with 'Königin von Dänemark' two of the best Albas and among the best OGRs.
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Which fragrance is stronger? F.P. or Queen of Denmark? Thanks.
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They both have strong fragrances, maybe 'k v D' has a slightly more damask rose smell. Perhaps Jay Jay could shed some light here, he has a particularly fine nose.
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#5 of 6 posted
23 DEC 18 by
Gdisaz10
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In my humid warm climate KvD is not very fragrant just slightly
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#6 of 6 posted
23 DEC 18 by
Gdisaz10
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The best Alba for me is Great Maiden's Blush
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#4 of 6 posted
7 MAY 17 by
Tessie
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Her disease resistance here in my Southern California garden has been excellent. Mainly disease pressure here is from mildew and rust (only occasionally is blackspot seen on any roses in my garden--many years there is none). FP hasn't shown any of these, and I've been growing her since the mid 1990s. Felicite Parmentier has the best fragrance of all my roses, and the most powerful and wafting. She is my favorite rose.
This has been a bad year for diseases on roses (an excellent rain year with over 20 inches following several years of severe drought), and some that I have never seen mildew on are covered in it. The same for rust. Some roses have lots of it. And even blackspot on 2 or 3 of my roses. Not a happy surprise, but soon we will have typical dry summer heat and blackspot doesn't seem to thrive in such conditions.
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Initial post
2 JUL 18 by
Tessie
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Available from - High Country Gardens
https://www.highcountrygardens.com/perennial-plants/shrubs/rosa-pulverulenta-pine-scented-rose
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