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Who knows where I can get a start of californica? I have seen the nurseries listed, but they are out of the country. I can't import it. There has to be somebody who grows this species in the country. Or has some seeds to trade :)
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I will add it to the list, Jason. I have the R. Californica they selected to grow in the Historic Sacramento Cemetery in Sacramento, Ca. There are suckers exiting the bottom of the container and it needs cleaning up, anyway.
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I was going to say there are many variations on rosa californica. I have one also that is probably not the one the good folks in Sacto "selected." What I have is one I got originally from the Native plants nursery on the outskirts of San Juan Capistrano called Tree of Life Nursery. They also have Rosa minutifolia, which you would probably also like. However, since you don't say where you are, I guess there are two options here -- come get a piece of mine in San Diego, or drive on out Highway 74 in San Juan Capistrano if that is closer. Or get Kim's.
ps Forestfarms.com in Oregon is another good place to get most species roses, but I don't see californica on their list at the moment. It might be too common for them.
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I'm actually currently in San Diego! I would love to come and get a piece of some minutifolia and/or some californica! Email me and I'll give you my cell phone number :).
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Well then, I should probably also invite you to the San Diego Rose Society meeting tomorrow night, Monday, June 18, at which our topic will be hybridizing roses. Come one, come all, 7 pm at Casa Del Prado, room 101, in Balboa Park. If you haven't been there before, it's across the street from the museum of natural history and next door to the junior theater bldg.
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No way! That's fantastic! I'm so excited! I have been obsessively reading about roses for weeks now. And now you say you have the rose I am looking for and you have it miraculously here in the place I am visiting next to the rose garden that I love to visit and I get to attend a rose group meeting tommorow night! Pinch me. I will be there.
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Californica's foliage smells so nice! I have seen it at Walter Anderson nursery but it was in bad shape and it did not have fragrant foliage and someone bought it. I also saw it in someone's garden. It had beautiful lilac flowers. I was mesmerized. But Kathy gave me a sucker from her yard. I really like because it has very fragrant foliage. It has a very woodsy piney smell to it. I am so happy to have it. I feel like I have something no one else has.
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#8 of 14 posted
20 JUN 18 by
 Tessie
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I would suggest you get R. californica 'First Dawn'. It is a selection of the species by Suncrest Nurseries. They don't sell direct to the public but many nurseries can get their plants.
The two selections of the species I grow are First Dawn and Los Berros. First Dawn is the better one by far IMHO. It blooms prolifically and repeatedly while Los Berros only lightly blooms with almost no repeat (it is also a water hog). First Dawn blooms in huge sprays and is extremely fragrant. The foliage has a mild to moderate peppery scent. Sets abundant hips with plenty of seeds. Not very thorny (Los Berros is loaded with thorns and prickles). Both are shade tolerant. First Dawn will climb with support. It is blooming now. I'm not sure there are any hips at present as birds like them.
Rancho Santa Ana Botanic Garden grows R. californica from different parts of the state. I've seen all their other selections. They also grow First Dawn and Los Berros where I bought mine. First Dawn is my favorite but my second favorite one is a plant from San Diego County. It is very nice. The RSABG nursery is closed for the summer. However, earlier this year they did have available in the nursery R. californica grown from their own stock. Unfortunately I didn't note which one.
Melissa
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Hi Tessie,
I have been trying to get a First dawn for many years now but couldn't. I first read about from your post on the Houzz. From reading your comments of how fragrant it is and it wafts, I wanted one. I actually drove with my sister to the Rancho...but at the time they only had the Rosa californica without the First dawn so I assumed it was not the cultivar. Anyway the two plants were very thorn and the one survived hardly had any flowers.
Once a while I came across your post like this one again, and it stirred my wanting longing to get one. Sigh...I don't know why it is so hard to get one.
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#11 of 14 posted
12 JUN by
Tessie
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Hi Mandy Luu. It is Suncrest Nurseries that selected R. californica 'First Dawn'. They sell it to retail nurseries, so if you have a local retail nursery, you can ask them to get one (or two!) for you from Suncrest. As Suncrest doesn't sell direct to the public.
The Rancho Santa Ana Botanic Garden has changed its name to the California Botanic Garden. They grow 'First Dawn' on the grounds and periodically sell it in their on site Grow Native Nursery. Grow Native Nursery publishes an availability list which is updated every week on Thursday in the late afternnoon. The nursery is about to close for the summer on June 22. The current availability list doesn't have 'First Dawn' on it but as a matter of fact I bought another one from them last year. You can write to Grow Native Nursery and ask about 'First Dawn' at this address: gnnclaremont@calbg.org. Perhaps if you request it, they might make it available in the fall plant sale which is when they reopen after summer hiatus. The staff at GNN are really nice and helpful.
Melissa
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Yes, I know Suncrest is the one that introduced it. I emailed and called them a few years back, but they told me at the time they didn't have any. Kim just told me that they have some currently. I will ask my local nursey to get me one. Thank you.
Mandy
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#12 of 14 posted
12 JUN by
Tessie
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I have a habit of keeping pots with plant ID on them. And sure enough I found the one for the Rosa californica 'First Dawn' that I bought from CalBG's Grow Native Nursery last year. Kind of grubby but legible. Sure enough, from the code 'CBG' on the pot, they grew it rather than buying one from another nursery.
I haven't posted here for so long I've forgotten how to include a photo in my post.......
Melissa
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Hi Melissa,
Thank you for your reply. The plants I bought didn't have the First dawn following the Rosa californica. I called and emailed them before but never got any response. My wanting this First dawn started from reading your posts on Houzz. I have read your posts many times, and every time I read them, I started my search for First dawn again. ????. From what I have read on your posts, I really like your rose selections. I think your garden must be so beautiful.
Thank you again for your response.
Mandy
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#9 of 14 posted
20 JUN 18 by
Tessie
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I forgot to mention that Annie's Annuals grows a R. californica with good rebloom. Checking Annie's tonight finds that it is not in production. You could write and ask about it though. Here is the page for that plant: http://www.anniesannuals.com/plants/view/?id=2876
Melissa
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I have a rose book in my library somewhere that I remember seeing the parentage of this rose. It's Veilchenblau x Yesterday. I have a ton of rose books so I'll have to figure out which one, but it will give me a good project to work on.
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When you find the reference we will be happy to add the parentage. Thanks Jason.
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Hi Jason, were you ever able to find the listed parentage of Purple Skyliner?
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Is this rose cold hardy?
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You will probably get more helpful information if you revise your question to indicate to what zone or temperatures you want to know if it will withstand. I've grown it in Zones 9b and 10a and it was perfectly cold hardy in those conditions, so to answer your question as stated, yes, it is completely cold hardy. How cold are you wishing to grow it under?
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Supposedly I'm zone 7, but winters can be eratic. We occasiobally get a zone 5 type winter here and there.
I do know how to read the information on this page, but it's not always accurate.
I'd consider myself zone 6b.
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Thank you, that should help get you more useful information.
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Kim, could you tell me how this rose did for you in 9b? Is this really a continuous bloomer?
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The plant was completely healthy in Zone 10a Encino, CA. NO fungal diseases at all. The foliage was gorgeous and it grew vigorously. It flowered repeatedly, but any time the direct sun hit those petals, they fried like Comtesse du Cayla's and anything descended from Agalia (I'm looking at YOU Leonie Lamesch). I liked the plants, including Purpurea's, but not being able to enjoy flowers from them due to their inability to withstand the intensity of the sun was the deal breaker. I sent it, and them, on to other homes where they could be provided conditions and positions more suitable to their fragile petals. It likely would have flowered more "continuously" had the heat and water retention of that crumbling ancient sea floor hill could provide, but there was usually evidence of fried flower clusters on the plant.
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Thanks so much for your reply! I’m in Central Florida, so it’s intense sun pretty much all the time. This may not be for my yard but it sure is a pretty rose. Glad yours found a good home!
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You're welcome, but you can probably grow "sun azaleas" in the sun. Even amending for the acidity, we can't. The sun is too hot. Perhaps your humidity may help make the difference?
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Hi, Jason. It's cold hardy to at least z7a which is where I am.
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I have been very impressed with this rose. It really handles cold temperatures like a champ, and does well in drought and in boggy conditions. It holds onto its leaves unlike a lot of prima donnas, and it keeps its flowers for a very long time as well. The flowers start out basically off white but take on a very faint lavender silver color as the flower ages and become a very attractive HT pointed shape. The flowers have to be removed because they will remain even as the hip is forming. Such a neat combination of qualities. Great fragrance. This and its cousin, Blue Skies are going to become the basis of a great new generation of lavenders. Neither one has a color that can be compared to, say, "Blue Girl", but they are stronger plants. It's almost like having a faintly lavender version of "Carefree Beauty".
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Exquisite as it is opening but rather disappointing when fully open as in the pictures from Beth's Northern CA Rose Garden and Robert Neil Rippetoe, rather like 'Margaret Merril' the stamens spoil the flower. Maybe could make some nice crosses with 'Aschermittwoch' or 'Grey Pearl'.
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Grey pearl is not something I would mix back into modern roses anymore. I am certain that Distant Drums and the great many number of russet/lavender roses that exist now would achieve the same results in color but with seedlings much more healthy and worth the time. If you want to use grey pearl for a very specific reason, I think you should use Intermezzo or Lavender Pinnochio, which are both just a generation away from it.
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I grew Silver Shadows years ago in the mid SoCal desert. It is DEFINITELY a better rose for a cooler climate than one which regularly experiences triple digit heat. The flowers and foliage are too soft for such extremes. As for modifying its coloring, please look more closely at newer, healthier mauves such as Blue for You, Poseidon or something like them than going backwards to museum pieces such as Lavender Pinocchio or mauves from the fifties, sixties, seventies, etc. Each decade, the bar is raised dramatically. You may pick up some coloring you desire from these older types, but you are going to lose much more in health, vigor, architecture, etc.
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Thanks. You are right. Modern really is the way to go, but I love wild forms of plants.
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I don't blame you and I also love "museum pieces", or I wouldn't also grow Lilac Charm, virus indexed Sterling Silver and Grey Pearl, but NOT for breeding "improved" roses.
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Lol. You're going to smack me with a glove and challenge me to a duel for asking this,
But...
What about directly crossing fedt with a pepper scented china with eglanteria with primula?
Like (fedt x china) x ((primula x eglanteria) x china) ?
I mean, if the end result is a whole new class of shrub roses that are valued for foliage fragrance, that would make them pretty modern by definition.
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Not at all. First, I would select the healthier, more vigorous types of the China for where you are and make the Fed X China cross both ways to see which (if either) works. They may not. For years, I put Fed. on everything that moved and vice versa. The ONLY thing that produced any seeds with it was Orangeade. Orangeade is a rabbit on fertility drugs! I theorized that if it crossed with Orangeade, it should them cross with Dottie Louise (Orangeade X Basye's Legacy) to bring in the other species genes. It did. You will find them here as the DLFED crosses. Whatever crosses you desire using, make the reciprocal crosses, too. Many won't work in one direction, but may going the other way. Don't be disappointed when the foliage scent is severely diluted, or even lost, pretty early on. That's usually what happens.
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Hmm....where can I get dlfed or oedfed? Does anyone grow these?
That midnight blue x fed looked fantastic, as did the IHTXLB X FED. I have IHT. I also have Lilac Charm and Lila Banks. I love the general theme of crossing anemic or even excellent roses back to a species to attempt to reinvigorate it. I just got bracteata. I am going to make some really voracious stuff with it.
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I only grow the repeat flowering Oadefed now. I left the DLFED crosses behind due to their "enthusiastic" suckering habits and the reduced room in the new yard. There are a few gardens growing some of them, but the one I feel is the most potentially useful is DLFED 3 as it's the mossy one with the largest, most double flowers. DLFED 4 repeats well and resembles Gloire des Rosomanes in several ways. I also have DLFED 5 X Tom Thumb which repeats in my climate. I'm raising some selfs of it in hopes of obtaining a more dwarf habit. One you may also find intriguing is the Golden Angel X R. Soulieana from Mr. Moore.
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Both Buck mauves were junk here in Oregon, as well. Black spot, weak stems, and not all that large blooms at all. Neither stayed long with me. In fact, Neptune is superior in every way, except maybe hardiness and own-rooting(I didn't have a snap winter when I had the two).
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I have probably shared the story with you previously. If so, please forgive the repetition. I bought Blue Skies (BUCblu) the year before its official introduction. MUCH hype was made about Buck's "Blue Rose", touting it as "Ageratum Blue". I HAD to grow it. I loved the breeding and anything "blue" was on my radar. A group of Texas rose producers offered it budded for $25, PLUS shipping. Remember, that was nearly forty years ago and $25 for a bare root rose was HUGE. I received it and it was the single WORST plant I have ever endured. It had severe RMV, seldom producing a leaf without symptoms. It contracted rust, black spot AND mildew all together. The flowers had no shape and were frequently deformed and never lasted very long. Talk about disappointment. I gave it two years then dug it, chopped it in many pieces and sent it off to the landfill. It's still the most expensive bare root I have bought and that includes paying the equivalent of $15 - $18 each for the Harkness Hulthemias imported from Harkness when you could buy the J&P "Rose of the Year" Grade 1 for $5. Never again.
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#12 of 15 posted
4 MAR 22 by
styrax
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The mauve roses have really improved in the past 3 decades! Don't know if we are any closer to blue, but I was very impressed by Arctic Ice on the East Coast: while it takes colder weather to get the lavender colors, it is a sturdy bush.
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All color types have improved over the decades! As far as perfect health out here, NOTHING surpasses Blue for You. (Well, Eyes for You is AS rudely healthy out here.)
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Yeah, I remember. Its hard to complain when he gave us so many gifts, but, yeah, his mauves were stinkers lmao. So... bad.
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I grow it in my garden here in Stuttgart, Germany. i budded it myself with wood from a friend four years ago. It is always on the brink of death, but I like the color of the blooms...
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