HelpMeFind Roses, Clematis and Peonies
Roses, Clematis and Peonies
and everything gardening related.
most recent 14 NOV 17 SHOW ALL
Initial post 17 AUG 12 by Barden, Paul
Undoubtedly the WORST rose I have ever grown. If you ever wondered where the disease-ridden foliage of modern roses came from, plant yourself one of these! A truly wretched beast of a thing.
Reply #1 of 23 posted 18 AUG 12 by Rupert, Kim L.
Don't hold back Paul, tell us how you REALLY feel about it! I agree, occasionally gorgeous flower on a truly terrible plant.
Reply #2 of 23 posted 18 AUG 12 by HMF Admin
So... reading between the lines we're guessing you don't care for this particular rose?
Reply #3 of 23 posted 18 AUG 12 by Rupert, Kim L.
It served its purpose to bring the Foetida colors into modern roses, as well as short-lived foliage which becomes susceptible to fungal attacks more quickly. It is historically and genetically important as a museum piece. It can be extraordinary in the narrow band of climates in which it can be happy. Unfortunately, it is a very narrow, small number of the areas in which roses are grown. As a plant, no, I don't care for anything about it. It has some very interesting traits, such as the "Juicy Fruit Gum" scent of the sepals, peduncles and new growth and (sometimes) very beautifully colored flowers. Unfortunately, you have to take the whole package to get the fun parts and that's a pretty high price of admission.
Reply #4 of 23 posted 24 MAY 13 by goncmg
I have to re-post here and smile because right now my Soleil d'Or is covered in blooms (with that delicious juicy fruit gum smell) and my band, now a 2 x 2 taught shrublet, is beyond vigorous. Yes, I admit, per my prior post I DO give it its "medicine" almost daily but for me it is worth it. There is nothing like it. And it is beyond important in the history.............I keep waiting for this one to totally FAIL me, and maybe it still will. Maybe my clone is just very, unusually-ish strong. It isn't even close to the worst rose I have ever grown but that is what makes growing them such a fun challenge. And I am convinced that there may actually be some human-rose synergy in existence and with some I/we have it, others I/we don't. I cannot grow Tropicana no matter WHAT I do. I have never had a bad experience with Sterling Silver. A cool, dry spring STILL has my Daily Sketch almost defoliated with botrytis and blackspot even though nobody else of the 100+ has much if any of either and I spray DS nearly as much as this one here.....................a fascinating relic, works for me, seems like it doesn't for a lot, I love it and would never want to be without it at this point....................I DO feed it about 50% more than the others. It also lets me NOT water it about 50% as much as the others (all mine are in pots, I gambled and realized its heritage is DRY and yes, this seems to work).....and again, I spray it beyond belief but last year it barely lost a leaf to blackspot and shoots out basals at an amazing rate....................think Soleil and I have that "synergy" that Tropicana and others (Redgold, Cathedral, Black Baccara, Daily Sketch, Countess Vandal, APRIL IN PARIS (!) and more) I do not have................................
Reply #5 of 23 posted 24 MAY 13 by Rupert, Kim L.'s just lulling you into believing it isn't going to bite you! Once you're satisfied it is going to do its thing without issues, it will probably explode into fungal issues just before committing suicide!
Reply #6 of 23 posted 25 MAY 13 by goncmg
I refuse to believe it!!! LOL....but I didn't listen on Grey Pearl last year and my two bands bloomed themselves to death as you warned. Did really well until about August then one of the 2 just died. Then the other one went from looking good to looking upset and simply died over the winter in the imnsulated., never below 25 and often above 32 garage. !!!!!
Reply #7 of 23 posted 25 MAY 13 by Greenman
My Soleil d'Or is now almost three years old. I just posted some photos of its spring blossoms. It is true it has the worst blackspot of any other roses I have, but so far has sent out fresh growth periodically to make up for what is lost to blackspot. And to be honest, its only slightly worse than some of the mid-century roses like Circus or even some more modern ones like Overnight Scentsation. Right now, it is loosing most of its leaves and the more recent blossoms have been stunted, but it also has 3 basal breaks and several fresh growths from upper branches. Not that I would actually encourage anyone to grow it, mind. I fertilize it like heck and also occasionally give it a sulpher shower. Even then, it is usually covered in blackspot and has infrequent blooms other than the first flush.
Reply #8 of 23 posted 29 MAY 13 by Benaminh
Hmmm, go figure... there's a gigantic thicket of Soleil d'Or at the U.C. Berkeley Botanical Garden always covered in blooms. Guess it likes Strawberry Canyon's micro-climate.
Reply #9 of 23 posted 29 MAY 13 by Rupert, Kim L.
That's likely why it's as good as it is. Every rose is good somewhere. It appears this one has found its spot. IF you can see it perfect, it is spectacular. Unfortunately, it most often isn't. But, you can see why it was so exciting to Pernet when it flowered, can't you?
Reply #10 of 23 posted 30 MAY 13 by goncmg
Kim, exactly! Every rose is good SOMEWHERE and somehow, right? Be it just a strong clone or the right micro-climate or the handling by the grower that, for whatever reasons, "speaks" to the rose. This is why I guess so many of us are addicted to them! They are not "guaranteed" success stories but there are some GREAT success stories to talk about!
Reply #11 of 23 posted 11 FEB 15 by Salix
Very, very, very, very, very wierdly- this is one of the best spring performers in the practically uncared for Snug Harbor rose garden. Either mislabeled or somehow it tolerates a little salt, cold, humidity and rain much better than anywhere else. Stunning.
Reply #12 of 23 posted 11 FEB 15 by Rupert, Kim L.
The conditions are just right for it to be happy. Let the climate warm up sufficiently and see how it responds...
Reply #13 of 23 posted 11 FEB 15 by Salix
Heehee :P Or let the smog drift over once they finally extend the main road... Meanwhile I'll enjoy it
Reply #14 of 23 posted 12 FEB 15 by goncmg
Meanwhile a few years after my RAVE.....I still have my Soleil d'Or on its own roots. It is a lovely, small shrub in its pot. HOWEVER, lol, last summer it managed to RAIN in Columbus every single day. Usually Soleil had his "medicine" and yes, I would squirt him almost every day. But I lost the battle this year. And WHOA so did Soleil d'Or!!!! Wanna see a plant DENUDE from blackspot in a matter of HOURS? GOOD GRIEF! And once it did, there was no turning back. I won't toss it, it had 3 good summers with me albeit with DAILY "MEDICINE" but last year was a nightmare. It denuded around July 1 and tried to refoliate but then THOSE were knocked out. It sits, in my garage, awaiting spring. It is nude. It looks as it has looked since last July 1.
Reply #15 of 23 posted 12 FEB 15 by Salix
But those flowers and the scented growth make it almost worth it....

Now you can understand why this rose was released- the form and color of the rose is spectacular. It really was revolutionary, although it's a shame it's so so sick. I'll try to get a picture this May. It does not repeat.
Reply #16 of 23 posted 12 FEB 15 by goncmg
Oh yes, the scent is so unique! It smells like Juicy Fruit gum to me! There is nothing like Soleil. Quite a character. I have no plans to get rid of it. Just lots more "medicine." The first flush of blooms is insane! And it repeats very well, which surprised me.
Reply #17 of 23 posted 12 FEB 15 by Salix
The repeat is climate dependent, then! I have seen the foetida throw a bloom if it gets dry enough during the summer, so it goes under another dormancy. The thing got huge there, like a sprawling tree, with lots of foliage, and even more underneath it! The scent is a little more herbal-y I guess than gum, almost like it had a little Amol ( in it. God, I hate Amol... But this smells WAAAY better ;p
Reply #18 of 23 posted 13 FEB 15 by Salix
I wonder how Lady Penzance smell like?
Reply #20 of 23 posted 25 OCT 15 by Salix
I saw a bloom hidden under the rootstock's canes in Snug Harbor. Darn, such color! If it were not for the BS, it would be a great rose...
Reply #22 of 23 posted 30 JUL 17 by StrawChicago Alkaline clay 5a
Is this rose shade-tolerant, like 4 hours of evening sun, or does it need full-sun? Thanks.
Reply #19 of 23 posted 5 JUN 15 by Salix
Actually, it turns out they let ti grow big (wrist-wide canes), which they lob back enough to prevent all but the occasional bloom, forcing it to push out good growth :/ Also, the spot is good- sunny and dry
Reply #21 of 23 posted 5 JUN 17 by princesskatja
Definitely a dry climate rose. Here in Spokane, WA (if you are not familiar with Washington, the eastern side of the state is actually high desert, not "evergreen") it is happy and extremely healthy with zero treatment. But blackspot and mildew are virtually unknown here.

It shrugged off a terrible winter this year (2017) that killed off anything grafted and knocked nearly everything back to the ground. Not Soleil d'Or. It's bushy, and loaded with fat buds. And it was planted as a band only a couple of years ago.

So if you have hot, dry summers - it might still be worth growing!
Reply #23 of 23 posted 14 NOV 17 by slumgullion
I agree, Soleil is doing well here (this year at least) in the dry part of southern Oregon. Has been blooming all year (right up till now in November) and has kept all its leaves. This is only my second year with it (and last year it defoliated completely) so I'll see how it goes, but so far so good! (knock on wood)
most recent 14 FEB 17 SHOW ALL
Initial post 15 JUN 16 by Linda Perry
In the U.S., Duchesse d'Angouleme (ex Vintage Gardens per Janet Inada) is presently available at Rogue Valley Roses. I had a plant from Roses of Yesterday and Today, circa 1991, (previous garden) and though I haven't yet seen blooms on the plants from RVR, the leaves are the same. So pleased to find them!
Reply #1 of 2 posted 11 FEB 17 by Greenman
Yes, I have ordered one from them after asking which one it was. I had one from Vintage before I moved, this rose was lovely and soft and sooo fragrant. I'm rather surprised it is not more popular among people who love gallicas.
Reply #2 of 2 posted 14 FEB 17 by Linda Perry
It's just as pleasing and melting as you describe and I wanted to be sure, as you did, which rose was available there. When I began looking through HMF for a replacement for the rose I left behind, it appeared there were several different plants in different places given the ID, and certainly room for confusion. In fact, my appreciation for the great scholarship and efforts at HMF to create a really solid database was really cemented with this one! (Along with help trying to grasp the whole Agatha group!)

I notice you garden in Kansas so chill hours shouldn't ever be much of a problem for you! My experience with this plant in the Berkeley hills in the San Francisco area (with fairly low chill hours, ~500, at most) was that it always performed well, flowered early and abundantly and kept adding mass (as did 'Belle Sans Flatterie'.) The concern from folks in mild-winter areas about Gallicas "growing backwards" didn't come up.
most recent 2 FEB 17 HIDE POSTS
Initial post 2 FEB 17 by Greenman
Just thought I might share this from Northland Rosarium's page about this rose..."This rose has grown in our zone 5 garden for many years without winter protection." Since this rose is listed as zone 7, thought this might be relevant to some....
most recent 31 JAN 17 HIDE POSTS
Initial post 31 JAN 17 by Greenman
Was just thinking about the how my roses performed last year, and I must say this rose did better than expected. It had good repeat and came thru the summer dryness and heat better than most of my roses. Did better than it has in milder, wetter summers, when the repeat seemed less frequent.
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