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2 days ago
Another found rose (Spinosissima-seedling). Spotted less than a mile from the previous-one.
2 days ago
Cuttings of a found rose:
2 days ago
The rose-seeds, that I sowed in the beginning of 2018, are showing a "second flush".
4 days ago
SEEDS OUTSIDE THE HIP
(Part Three)


We have reached our last section on “External Seeds” or as the American Rose Hybridizers Association calls this phenomenon, “Exogenous Seeds”, and ran an article in their American Rose Hybridizers Association Newsletter Vol. XLVI No. 3/4 2015, titled “What to Do About Exogenous Seeds”.

A little rehash of the first and second article, what causes this phenomenon to occur and will it impact on the germination of the seeds, was there any rhyme or reason for this occurring and will this phenomenon affect my crosses?

On all occasions that I have seen, only a small number of each rose shows signs of this
phenomenon occurring, not the whole plant, “Peace” has a ratio of about 50% of the hips
affected, whilst “The Golden Child”, has a much smaller occurrence, initially, interestingly,
this phenomenon occurred on both cross pollinated and open pollinated hips. I initially
though, seeds are pushed outside of the hip at the commencement of the hips
development, this was the case for approximately the first 12 weeks, but as the hip
continued to develop, more seeds were forced externally as they continue to grow and
some are forced outside of the hip as each seed increases in size.

The following roses were selected for no other reason, except they were growing in my garden, or close to me, and is stated to that affect.

‘Peace” has large, cupped flowers with a high-centred form and an average diameter of 15 cm. The durable flowers are very full, with 40 to 43 petals. The vigorous shrub grows 120 to 200 cm high and 90 to 125 cm wide.

‘The Golden Child” Medium, floribunda form and an average diameter of 8 cm. The durable flowers are full, with 26 to 40 petals, borne mostly solitary, in small clusters bloom form. The vigorous shrub grows 120 to 1500 cm high and 170 to 200 cm wide.

“Joyce Abounding” ‘Joyce Abounding’ is a Mini-Flora, Miniature, and an average diameter of 5 cm. The flowers are very full, with 26 to 40 petals, in small clusters bloom form. The shrub grows to a height of up to 50 cm, 90 to 125 cm wide. [Note: My research indicated that even the largest of the hips within the test area, either, cross pollinated or open pollinated, failed to develop any external seeds.

“Iceberg” is a modern cluster-flowered floribunda rose cultivar, and blooms are about 5 cm in diameter and have 25 to 35 petals. They grow in clusters on long stems. Buds are long and pointed. The vigorous shrub grows 1.2 meters high and 1 meter wide.
As I do not have an “Iceberg” in my collection, the bushes I conducted my research was from a neighbours garden, although outside the controlled environment of my backyard, my research showed that even the largest of the hips within the test area failed to develop any external seeds. The roses I conducted my research on were open pollinated only, and displayed no signs of the “External Seeds”, phenomenon.

“Olde Fragrance” has medium, cupped flowers with a high-centred form and an average diameter of 14 cm. The durable flowers are very full, with 26 to 40 petals. The vigorous shrub grows 150cm high and 120 cm wide.
I do not have an “Olde Fragrance” in my collection, but was given the information for my research by Richard Walsh from his garden and experience with this rose. The following is, in part, what Richard sent to me.
I can't remember if ALL hips displayed External Seeds, but certainly the ones in question did, and if not all seeds, then the majority.

Conclusion:
My conclusion is not scientifically supported, nor is it academically supported, and the following are the findings that have been achieved by watching, measuring and taking notes and most importantly, watching the roses grow through each of the breeding cycle.

i. My findings, indicates that this phenomenon, is more likely to occur in species of roses that would normally produce physically larger seeds, and therefore larger hips. All the study subjects that displayed signs of the having being effected by the “External Seeds”, phenomenon, were flowers that had physically larger flowers. [My research did not prove that only roses that are physically larger, will be effected, but it does show that they are more likely to be effected by this phenomenon].[I should have conducted the same test using “Governor Macquarie”, that should have proven that point].
ii. The phenomenon, of seeds forming outside the hip has no rhyme or reason for its
occurrence.
iii. It seems, that this phenomenon, whilst it may affect a number of hips on a plant, rarely affect all the hips contained on the plant.
iv. Any external seed will proceed to germination at/or better than the rate of all of the other seeds.
v. External seeds should not be treated with any difference than any other seed from the hip.

My conclusions, is that this phenomenon, does not impacts on seed development, and they are as likely to succeed to germination, as of those not affected by this phenomenon.

I hope I have answered some questions and helped in some way.


Gary Wootton
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