HelpMeFind Roses, Clematis and Peonies
Roses, Clematis and Peonies
and everything gardening related.
most recent 4 NOV 22 HIDE POSTS
Initial post 4 NOV 22 by cooleyedbabe
Planted Hot Princess in 2016. Never gives me a bit of trouble. She's on east side of house in Portland, OR, 8b officially, but really more 9a. She gets 6 hours of sun Spring thru Summer, then in shade all day from about Oct. 1. to mid-March.
It finally stopped raining about the end of June 2022 (light rain). Then we had unseasonably hot summer. High 90s, a few days in 100s.
Although her blooms are red, like Alec's Red, they fad to reddish pink-purple when opening. The color is not ugly, but not attractive. However it takes a long time for her to open so it's not really an issue with me. I get more blooms than I can keep up with. She is so full-petaled that her stamens never show. After cutting, and petals are falling, stamens don't show til there's nearly nothing left.
Even in full shade, her flowers fade soon after they are 1/2 way open. I do love her fluted petals, very feminine and befitting a princess. I have her son, Hot Prince, who looks like he's going to be redder and not have fluted petals. In nature the males are usually more colorful than the girls. LOL!
Really vigorous and disease resistant. Roses around her ( no closer than 3') got canker, blackspot and mildew (Double Delight). Princess stayed clean. I guess being a Princess she felt she was too good to catch anything!
Tall and stately, beautiful form. Easily 8' if I didn't keep cutting her back to 5' or 6'. No matter how much I prune her back she never stops blooming, even now she has at least a dozen blooms.
Canes very strong regardless of height. Even in some pretty strong winds, canes don't break. Her blooms are ALL solitary on very long, strong stems. Lasts very long after cutting. A florist told me to refrigerate my roses (in water) overnight. Made a huge difference in how long they lasted. I only do it once, right after I cut them.
Any questions? Love to expound but I never get notice that anyone replies. I have the thing checked in my account that says to notify me about replies.
Reply #1 of 1 posted 4 NOV 22 by HMF Admin
Wow, now that's member participation on steroids ! Thank you so much for sharing your experience !
most recent 3 NOV 22 HIDE POSTS
Initial post 3 NOV 22 by cooleyedbabe
I purchased Flamenco from J&P in 2019. There was a small lesion near the base of one cane. At that time I was particularly ignorant of rose diseases.
From 2005 to 2013, grew a dozen or so HTs & GFs about 300 yds. from the beach of Pierpont Bay, Ventura, CA (e.g. Blue Girl, Black Baccara, Pope Pius, Gold Medal, can't remember others) . Only disease was mildew on BB. Blackspot, insects, what were those? Innocence is bliss.
2013 moved back to Portland, OR (9b). Winter 2013 tore out old rose garden, fumigated, let it set (horticulturist advice). Fall 2014 ordered roses for Spring 2015 planting. All looked good, grew well, some blackspot easily controlled, no mildew.
Spring 2019 received Flamenco HT from J&P. There was a small lesion near the base of one cane. At that time, since I hadn't any uncontrollable problems, I was pretty ignorant about rose diseases. I had never heard of Rose Canker. Researching the internet, I learned that the "lesion" was rose canker. Yes, a particularly unusual presentation according to what I read. Soon my Flamenco had a "lesion" at the top of a cane. I removed it. Then another, removed, then another, removed, til no canes left. The new canes were less than pencil in dia. Flowers 2 1/2" then up to 3". BUT the worst part was, over the next 2 years, canker spread to 1/2 my 40 roses. I should have pulled it when the canker kept popping up but I couldn't give up. Finally did give up and burned it. Keep a sharp eye for lesions no matter how small. Cut canes out as soon as I see it.
Didn't think of refund or replacement. I figured it was just a fluke. So this Spring I couldn't resist this beautiful baby especially after reading HMF comments. Long story short: Ordered 3, all had rose mosaic and small canker lesions, upon delivery. I immediately informed J & P (sent photos). They made full refund. A month later I received 3 more Flamencos?! Go figure. They too had mosaic but no canker. But I guess mosaic is not fatal, just weird looking. I constantly patrol and remove any canker. I don't know if I'll ever eradicate it. Probably not. Ironically, new 2022 roses from 3 other nurseries either had canker lesions or lesions within 3 days. Planted nowhere near other roses (a new bed). From 1 nursery, the canker was extensive down into the graft. With detailed photos I got a full refund. I planted those in a pasture across a paved driveway behind a big metal barn. I wanted to see if the canker had destroyed the graft. The canes never grew. The other roses just had extensive lesions which I cut out. That only left 1" - 2" canes that got more lesions. I gave up and burned them all.
Yes, I have had several rosarians confirm that it's canker. It wasn't til 2020 that I learned to spray my pruners with alcohol or a disinfectant. Now I generously spray pruners between each cutting on the same bush. Then I immerse cutters to top of handles before moving to the next bush. I spray my gauntlet gloves too and wash them daily. I am getting a handle on things. I'm up to 55 HTs (includes 6 Flamencos LOL!) and 20 GFs.
most recent 2 NOV 22 SHOW ALL
Initial post 22 OCT 22 by cooleyedbabe
Depth to plant grafted roses? I have repeatedly read to plant the graft above the soil. Now to day I read from a prominant, respected rose grower/seller, to plant graft 2 " below the soil? Then I read an article here where a very highly respected rose expert says that nothing with roses is certain. They live to bewilder us. LOL! I'm beginning to believe that. So I'm very novice compared to most of you folks but would welcome any opinions/comments, etc.
Thank you, Jeri
Reply #1 of 4 posted 22 OCT 22 by Robert Neil Rippetoe
Seek local advice.

This depends on personal preference, climate and soil conditions.

If you garden in a colder climate, conventional wisdom is to bury them.

Keep in mind, not all roses are budded.
Reply #2 of 4 posted 22 OCT 22 by Margaret Furness
And this, too: if the rose is one that will sucker on its own roots, I wouldn't put the bud union in the soil.
For those that don't, I think giving the scion (the top part) a chance to make its own roots, by putting the bud union below the soil, gives it more chance of coming back after fire, line-trimmers, bounding dogs etc.
Reply #3 of 4 posted 22 OCT 22 by Robert Neil Rippetoe
Good point Margaret.
Reply #4 of 4 posted 2 NOV 22 by MADActuary
I believe you said you are in Portland, OR - thus you don't experience much freezing weather. I would recommend you plant the bud union right at ground level or a smidge above. Usually, the plant will sink down a tad over time so that would result in a good depth. There is more than one way to skin a cat but for me, in zone 5b, roses planted with the bud union too deep don't seem to grow as well as those with the bud union at or very near ground level. They may be hardier come winter if planted deep, but they just don't seem to grow as well.

That said if you planted just a little above or below ground level - I'm sure everything would work out just fine. Happy planting!
most recent 23 OCT 22 SHOW ALL
Initial post 25 FEB 04 by Anonymous-797
I just read Gwen's review of Stainless Steel. As an organic gardener, I would recommend to anyone living near a coastal area to avoid hybrid teas and grow rugosas instead. Hybrid teas require too much fertilizer and insecticides (environmental "unbalance"). Rugosas are native to seaside areas and are tough, fragrant, and require little fertilization and attention. They hate all types of spraying. They practically grow in sand in their native provinces. The best performing plants of any kind are either native species or those grown in areas that mimic their original surroundings. Gwen would have an easier time making the switch. Please be assured-this is not an inappropriate comment, just sound advice for gardeners like myself who treasure our earth.
Reply #1 of 15 posted 28 APR 05 by Unregistered Guest
I live on the coast which rugosas do you recommend?
Reply #2 of 15 posted 2 MAY 05 by anonymous-18579
Please email me and let me know what size you have in mind. Do you have a large or small garden? More hybrids have appeared on the market to help us with the shrinking size of our garden space. I can narrow down the choices for you if size is an issue. If not, then I'll give you the names of some good ones. By the way, any particular color choice? Victoria
Reply #3 of 15 posted 22 MAY 05 by anonymous-18579
Dear Cecile; I did reply to you, but I don't know if the message got through to you. Please let me know. Thanks, Victoria. I apologize for taking so long to reply. I did not realize that I had received a reply until last week. Sincerely, Victoria. PS-I actually gave you a list of rugosas and landscaping roses. If you did not receive it, I will write it again and re-send it.
Reply #4 of 15 posted 22 MAY 05 by anonymous-18579
Dear Celia; I apologize for misspelling your name. Please let me know if you received my list of rugosas. Thank you, Victoria
Reply #5 of 15 posted 23 MAY 05 by Unregistered Guest
Reply #6 of 15 posted 24 MAY 05 by anonymous-18579
Dear Celia; I will send you a list tomorrow evening. I wrote a long list for you but evidently the program did not transmit. I'll be in touch shortly. It is 1:30 a.m. here. Blessings, Victoria
Reply #8 of 15 posted 28 MAY 05 by anonymous-18579
Celia, I have twice sent you a list of rugosas that was a page long, and each time the list did not transmit. Is there some way that I can send the list to you directly or through another website? The only information that I see posted is the addendum about the yellow rugosas, and this is an afterthought that closes out the huge list that I sent to you. I wrote a list of rugosas by colors and sizes, and the names of hybridizers. Victoria
Reply #7 of 15 posted 24 MAY 05 by anonymous-18579
Celia, I forgot to tell you that the yellow rugosas have a reputation for not being as disease resistant as the red, pink or purple varieties. I have a pavement rugosa that does get some rust, but that does not prevent it from blooming or developing new, disease-free foliage. As a matter of fat, rugosas hate being sprayed with any kind of chemical, and the leaves will be damaged if they are sprayed. They are tough enough to shake off anything but human abuse. I hope this helps. If you do decide on a rose, you may wish to log onto helpmefind,com or for more information about individual varieties. I am also container-growing Henry Hudson-disease free. Sincerely, Victoria
Reply #9 of 15 posted 6 JUN 05 by anonymous-18579
Celia, this is a third try at getting a rugosa list to you. I may have to do this in several postings. I am going to give you several websites, and you can read the characteristics of each rugosa and see what sounds right for your garden. Look up; (this is the Antique Rose Emporium);; These nurseries sell own-root rugosas of every color and size. Wayside Gardens and White Flower Farm also have rugosas, but they may be grafted. I don't recommend them if you live in a cold climate. Ralph Moore, the "miniature rose king," has just hybridized and introduced the first striped rugosa,"Moore's Striped Rugosa." The site is This rose grows to about three feet. If you want roses for a warm climate, always go with the hybrids. The species rugosas prefer cooler climates. The "Pavement" series of rugosas are for smaller gardens. Arena Roses is selling a floribunda for the coast: "Preference." It is in their catalog. Some of the Agricultural Canada roses are also disease resistant. A good groundcover is Charles Albanel. You may also want to try "The Fairy." It is a polyantha, but it is very disease resistant and extremely rugged. It will bloom in almost near-shade in very warm or hot conditions. The websites that I have given you have separate listings for rugosas. I hope this helps. Victoria. PS_Rugosas have thorns like nails. The larger roses make good barrier plantings. The smaller ones can be grown in containers.
Reply #10 of 15 posted 6 JUN 05 by anonymous-18579
Recommended larger rugosas: Topaz Jewel (yellow)

Sarah Van Fleet
Fru Dagmar Hastrup (also Hartopp)
Blanc Double de Coubert
Linda Campbell
Jens Munk: many rugosas have beautiful hips that can be made into jelly, tea or left on the bush for birds. I like to eat them raw, sweet and crunchy.--high in vit c.
David Thompson
Martin Frobisher
Smaller: Pavement series
Foxi Pavement
Pink, Purple, Pierette, Showy, White, Pristine Pavement
Henry Hudson
Rotes Meer
Reply #11 of 15 posted 5 APR 10 by York Rose
Do please be aware that if you live in coastal New England Rosa rugosa, while beautiful in the garden, can become invasive (which is why it's so prevalent along some of the beaches).

Furthermore, while it's a terrific landscaping flowering shrub (truly!), if you plan to cut your roses to bring indoors and enjoy in vases, Rosa rugosa and its various color iterations (such as Rosa rugosa alba, a magnificent white rose that is brilliant white without a hint of any other color, a rarity in white roses) has almost no vase life at all. In the vase the flowers can shatter within hours.

(That may not be true of the rugosa hybrids with other species. I am not familiar with their vase lives.)
Reply #12 of 15 posted 9 JUN 10 by timdufelmeier
Why would any self respecting hmf member even want to live in a world without HYBRID TEAS? What a dreadful concept!
Rugosas are devine but I WANT AND NEED MY HYBRID TEAS. I live in a little coastal town called Los Angeles, California and I have never even considered using sprays on my 400 roses neither do my rosemaniac friends.

Until rugosas grow
Only hybrid teas can
Fill the bill
Reply #13 of 15 posted 2 JAN 13 by goncmg
Your comme made me laugh, I love it, I feel the same way. Not a rose in existence that I don't love but love Hybrid Teas.....
Reply #14 of 15 posted 10 FEB 20 by mamabotanica
Totally agree (also live in So Cal - out Pasadena way) and I love my hybrid teas! Got rid of my rugosas because I didn't need a rose to take over the garden.
Reply #15 of 15 posted 23 OCT 22 by cooleyedbabe
I too can't imagine a life without HTs! I lived at the beach for 8 years, on the Pierpont Bay lanes, Ventura, CA, about 800 ft. from the bay. I "doctored" the soil (if you can call sand "soil") with cal-pro and earthworms. I found that earthworms literally converted the sand into soil. I bought a lot of earthworms to do that. I had Stainless Steel, Blue Girl, Pope John Paul II, Black Baccara, Speelwark, Gold Medal and 4 other various colors but can't remember their names. The only one to get any disease was BB, who got mildew. No insect problems. I sprayed BB every 3 months with the bicarb solution which controlled it. I used natural fertilizers, e.g. alfalfa pellets, cottonseed meal, etc.
Moved back to Portland in 2013 with acidic soil, e.g. 4 to 4.5 ph. Have had nothing but problems with blackspot, mildew (not as much) and canker. Rose expert advised that soil ph is the problem. Rose defenses decline if soil is not near neutral as they can't absorb nutrients in the soil. Very excited to see the results next Spring.
Because we have soooo much rain here, I also have an ongoing battle with moles. They have decimated my Portland earthworm population. But now I am armed and dangerous...caught one this week.
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